Maura Murray

I´d bet the car was fine, but something had happened, maybe during winter break, to make her (them?) not want to be seen driving it.

It was said by family Maura was driven to clinicals and other places by friends/fellow students.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Thanks. The timing seems to make sense. Regarding Maura not wanting to drive the Saturn, I think it was said she refused to drive it at all. Would this refusal to drive it have started when she returned to Amherst or before? There was some odd story about the Saturn being towed back to Amherst and Maura making a scene about it. Why tow it to Amherst if it needed fixing? Would Fred not touch it either? Why?

hannah,
Unless this is another fabrication it would seem that Fred Murray was intending to get Maura another, newer car. Provided this is indeed correct, why making this kind of purchase unless the Saturn for some reason was deemed to be unreliable one way or other.

If we surmise that it was indeed Maura seen walking in a westerly direction on Rte 112 in or near Swiftwater village, where would that leave the mysterious red truck as seen by witness RO earlier that evening?
Also, according to James Renner´s interview with Lt Scarinza, Scarinza seems to suggest that Maura likely was picked up and entered a car at or near the WB location.
And, adding to this, what are we to make of the supposed observation of the CW of seeing someone walking/running along Rte 112 some 4-5 miles east of the WB close to the 112-116 intersection.
As has been mentioned on this forum many times in the last few months, the NH judicial authorities seem to be indicating that the last known location of Maura has somehow been pinpointed, and that this location is unlikely to be by the WB curve.
Again, so many things are not adding up here....

By the way, has anybody seen any kind of updates regarding the human skull found on Danby Hill Road in Danby, Vermont, in mid-February this year.
It has now been three months and, as far as I have been able to find out, absolutely no new information being made public.

Bumping for Maura wrote:

<quoted text>
hannah,
Unless this is another fabrication it would seem that Fred Murray was intending to get Maura another, newer car. Provided this is indeed correct, why making this kind of purchase unless the Saturn for some reason was deemed to be unreliable one way or other.

IDK, but there has been no verification of this story. No dealership identified, no telling anyone else Fred was in town to buy her a new car. Could be nothing, but worth checking into IMO.

Bumping for Maura wrote:

If we surmise that it was indeed Maura seen walking in a westerly direction on Rte 112 in or near Swiftwater village, where would that leave the mysterious red truck as seen by witness RO earlier that evening?
Also, according to James Renner´s interview with Lt Scarinza, Scarinza seems to suggest that Maura likely was picked up and entered a car at or near the WB location.
And, adding to this, what are we to make of the supposed observation of the CW of seeing someone walking/running along Rte 112 some 4-5 miles east of the WB close to the 112-116 intersection.
As has been mentioned on this forum many times in the last few months, the NH judicial authorities seem to be indicating that the last known location of Maura has somehow been pinpointed, and that this location is unlikely to be by the WB curve.
Again, so many things are not adding up here....

Scarinza is basing his opinion on the dog that traced her(?) scent to a spot close to SBD´s driveway. With dogs it´s hit or miss, either Maura really was picked up by a vehicle at that spot or she wasn´t. Or maybe the scent belonged to someone else (not very likely). Another possibility is she was picked up at that spot, but by a vehicle driving west that let her off somewhere (what was she doing in the meantime?), and she proceeded by foot. This would of course make CW´s sighting be of someone else and not related to Maura. I´m not really advocating one scenario (or direction) over the other, but would like to explore every possibility that makes at least some sense.

There definitely was some odd story about her possibly needing the car towed back to Amherst. I think the story was that since Sharon had gotten her AAA+, which has a lot more mileage tows than regular AAA coverage, they said that she was going to drive the car part of the way there and then get it towed the rest of the way. Or something like that.
That whole story makes no sense at all either. If this car is so screwed up why would they bother to have it towed to Amherst? So it can die on the way to one of her clinicals or something? SO she would have to find a mechanic out there when she's in school?
Other thing that makes no sense about this whole thing is the fact that she had just come back to school at the beginning of February. WHy wouldn't Fred just buy her the car before that? As opposed to getting the car towed to campus, her finding rides, then him coming out there to buy her a new car?

I guess none of that really matters because she did drive the car back to Amherst and it seems like it was driving fine.

The bigger question about all this in my mind is why all these stories about how bad her car was? Why are they trying to convince the public that her car barely even drove, she refused to drive it and that she almost had to have it towed back to campus. What is the goal of these stories being out there?

Exactly, Bob. Why all these stories?

To me it looks like the whole entire story about them looking for cars is bullshit.
I have a few reasons for thinking this.
First of all Nobody has any recollection of Maura saying anything about it, not any of the people who were at the party in the dorm that night, not even her friend who went out to dinner with her and Fred at the ABC. Getting a new car is generally an exciting thing for a young person and I can't see her not talking to anybody about it, and not talking about it at all with her father and her friend after they were supposedly out looking for cars all day. But theoretically everyone of her friend's memories just aren't very good.

But then we have Fred's written statement to the Umass cops, which differs vastly from his statements made to the media. I don't think he ever expected his written statement to LE to be made publc, but shouldn't they at least be similar?

He told the public that they went out looking for cars that day, they had picked one out that they both liked and he was going to return to Amherst the following weekend to actually buy the car.

Ok but he told LE that he had brought $4,000 with him to go car shopping. They started off going to a dealer in Northampton that her boyfriend had good luck with pereviously. They didn't find one there, they went to a couple other spots, in hadley I believe; they didn't find one and they went back to Amherst to go to diner at the ABC.

Those are 2 fairly different stories. In the first one he says they found one and were planning on returning the following week to buy it. In the second one he told LE he had the money on him to buy it, but they didn't find one.

If this whole thing happened shouldn't it be rather easy to tell the story the same? Why is the story so different? Why did he tell LE that he had $4000 on him for the car bu they didn't find one?
Is this because he knows that LE would be able to obtain his bank records and see that he had withdrawn 4 grand? So them not finding one was his excuse for not spending the 4, but what I wonder is was the 4 g's ever deposited back into the bank?

I obviously can't be sure, none of us can, but I don't think they went out looking for cars that day. WHy did he tell the cops he had the $ but they didn't find a car; and why did he tell the public they picked out a car but didn't buy it taht weekend? If he had the money on him, and they didn't find one, why didn't they go look at other places the following day? If he had the $ on him and they picked out a car why didn't they just buy it? The whole story makes no sense.
I think his written statement to LE shows that he isn't being truthfull about this whole story. Clearly its a stretch to say that he's done something wrong because this story is a lie but it sure doesn't look good.

The other thing about this written statement is that in my eyes he confirmed that she did have a new BF. He mentions her in his written statement. He said they went to a dealer where her BF had good luck in the past. Well Billy is from Ohio and was stationed in OK. He never lived in western mass so I think we can be pretty confident that he didn't buy a car in Northampton. SO he must be talking about her new BF, right? How could he be talking about Billy? Did he ever live out western mass? as far as I know he didnt.

now that is an excellent question hannah, why all these stories?
What's the purpose?

To me it looks like the whole entire story about them looking for cars is bullshit.
I have a few reasons for thinking this.
First of all Nobody has any recollection of Maura saying anything about it, not any of the people who were at the party in the dorm that night, not even her friend who went out to dinner with her and Fred at the ABC. Getting a new car is generally an exciting thing for a young person and I can't see her not talking to anybody about it, and not talking about it at all with her father and her friend after they were supposedly out looking for cars all day. But theoretically everyone of her friend's memories just aren't very good.

But then we have Fred's written statement to the Umass cops, which differs vastly from his statements made to the media. I don't think he ever expected his written statement to LE to be made publc, but shouldn't they at least be similar?

He told the public that they went out looking for cars that day, they had picked one out that they both liked and he was going to return to Amherst the following weekend to actually buy the car.

Ok but he told LE that he had brought $4,000 with him to go car shopping. They started off going to a dealer in Northampton that her boyfriend had good luck with pereviously. They didn't find one there, they went to a couple other spots, in hadley I believe; they didn't find one and they went back to Amherst to go to diner at the ABC.

Those are 2 fairly different stories. In the first one he says they found one and were planning on returning the following week to buy it. In the second one he told LE he had the money on him to buy it, but they didn't find one.

If this whole thing happened shouldn't it be rather easy to tell the story the same? Why is the story so different? Why did he tell LE that he had $4000 on him for the car bu they didn't find one?
Is this because he knows that LE would be able to obtain his bank records and see that he had withdrawn 4 grand? So them not finding one was his excuse for not spending the 4, but what I wonder is was the 4 g's ever deposited back into the bank?

I obviously can't be sure, none of us can, but I don't think they went out looking for cars that day. WHy did he tell the cops he had the $ but they didn't find a car; and why did he tell the public they picked out a car but didn't buy it taht weekend? If he had the money on him, and they didn't find one, why didn't they go look at other places the following day? If he had the $ on him and they picked out a car why didn't they just buy it? The whole story makes no sense.
I think his written statement to LE shows that he isn't being truthfull about this whole story. Clearly its a stretch to say that he's done something wrong because this story is a lie but it sure doesn't look good.

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

To me it looks like the whole entire story about them looking for cars is bullshit.
I have a few reasons for thinking this.
First of all Nobody has any recollection of Maura saying anything about it, not any of the people who were at the party in the dorm that night, not even her friend who went out to dinner with her and Fred at the ABC. Getting a new car is generally an exciting thing for a young person and I can't see her not talking to anybody about it, and not talking about it at all with her father and her friend after they were supposedly out looking for cars all day. But theoretically everyone of her friend's memories just aren't very good.
But then we have Fred's written statement to the Umass cops, which differs vastly from his statements made to the media. I don't think he ever expected his written statement to LE to be made publc, but shouldn't they at least be similar?
He told the public that they went out looking for cars that day, they had picked one out that they both liked and he was going to return to Amherst the following weekend to actually buy the car.
Ok but he told LE that he had brought $4,000 with him to go car shopping. They started off going to a dealer in Northampton that her boyfriend had good luck with pereviously. They didn't find one there, they went to a couple other spots, in hadley I believe; they didn't find one and they went back to Amherst to go to diner at the ABC.
Those are 2 fairly different stories. In the first one he says they found one and were planning on returning the following week to buy it. In the second one he told LE he had the money on him to buy it, but they didn't find one.
If this whole thing happened shouldn't it be rather easy to tell the story the same? Why is the story so different? Why did he tell LE that he had $4000 on him for the car bu they didn't find one?
Is this because he knows that LE would be able to obtain his bank records and see that he had withdrawn 4 grand? So them not finding one was his excuse for not spending the 4, but what I wonder is was the 4 g's ever deposited back into the bank?
I obviously can't be sure, none of us can, but I don't think they went out looking for cars that day. WHy did he tell the cops he had the $ but they didn't find a car; and why did he tell the public they picked out a car but didn't buy it taht weekend? If he had the money on him, and they didn't find one, why didn't they go look at other places the following day? If he had the $ on him and they picked out a car why didn't they just buy it? The whole story makes no sense.
I think his written statement to LE shows that he isn't being truthfull about this whole story. Clearly its a stretch to say that he's done something wrong because this story is a lie but it sure doesn't look good.
The other thing about this written statement is that in my eyes he confirmed that she did have a new BF. He mentions her in his written statement. He said they went to a dealer where her BF had good luck in the past. Well Billy is from Ohio and was stationed in OK. He never lived in western mass so I think we can be pretty confident that he didn't buy a car in Northampton. SO he must be talking about her new BF, right? How could he be talking about Billy? Did he ever live out western mass? as far as I know he didnt.

I totally agree with you, both on the differing versions of the car buying story and the boyfriend referred to being someone other than Billy. Question is, why did Fred come to Amherst? To meet Maura, obviously, but is seems rather coincidental he went to Amherst with $4000 in his pocket two days before Maura disappeared.

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

now that is an excellent question hannah, why all these stories?
What's the purpose?

I don´t know, but I´m sure there IS a purpose.

There's gotta be a purpose, but what? All of these stories can't just be because Fred is an idiot and doesn't remember ANYTHING

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

Even the local from a prominent family. First of all nobody has ever named this guy on any thread ...
Even still nobody is saying this kids name, nobody is saying the name of his business.

Jenkins, you spew so much on this thread that is simply untrue it's unbelievable. Most of the time, you add that your opinions are "fact" when they are simply not. This is one of them.

FACT: The full name of the "local" has been posted in this same thread on three occasions, twice outright and once reposted in a quote. On another site pertaining to MM, the name of the local is not mentioned, however they direct readers to one of those Topix posts where it IS mentioned and give the post number in the thread to easily locate it.

You are truly obtuse when you continue on proclaiming that no harm can come to a person who is outed on the Internet, with their real name and personal information, with speculation that they have MURDERED another human being.

How's this - since you can't comprehend how people might be damaged by having their personal information posted in a forum such as this, why don't you provide us all with your real name, address, phone number and email address and post a photograph of yourself? You're not being accused of murder, you're just a person posting on an anonymous forum, and surely don't have any reason to worry about releasing that information. You're just chatting, right? Kicking around ideas. Speculating on how lots of different people may have MURDERED Maura Murray. Just talk. You have nothing to fear, right? So why don't you post that personal information for all of us who respond here, and all the other thousands of people who lurk here, to see? OK? If you feel uncomfortable doing so, tell us why.

I'll bet Beagle can tell us why. His real name has been posted here, with lots of people here searching for his address, and posting his work location. His real photograph was posted on Renner's blog. He is a person that very obviously has some mental issues and probably needs some help. He claims to have been harassed by people involved in some way with MM. Don't you even have a clue as to why he uses "Phoebe Prince" as a nickname here? You have berated him over and over here, called him horrible names, speculated that HE killed MM - go read post #19075 here (can't find the original at the moment) where you have this to say, among other things: "He certainly deserves a serious looking at, or at least to get the shit kicked out of him. For the videos he's posted I've never seen anyone deserve a bigger ass-beating" and "Someone like that yur not Gonna make him feel bad by anything u write so that's why I suggest multiple beatings is what he deserves. Not saying I'm gonna do that(as much as I want to), but that's clearly what he deserves." His real name being posted here has been picked up and carried to other sites, where I see comments posted threatening him. Renner brought him to a much wider audience on Fox News, and impulsively speculated that he could have been involved in the murder of Melissa Jenkins prior to the actual murderers being identified. Think about if just ONE of the people reading all this shit about him is a psycho vigilante type who decides to take matters into his own hands, maybe doing what you recommend, kicking the shit out of him, or worse? Do you think that perhaps that has crossed Beagle's mind a few times? Do you think that might cause him a great deal of stress or fear? Especially when he appears to have a vulnerable state of mind?

Nobody has to list any incidents of harassment or damage. The psychological damage of having your real name associated with the possible murder of another human being is enough. If you cannot see that, you have something really wrong with you Please stop the ridiculously long, multiple, repetitive posts about it, and let the conversation stay focused on Maura Murray.

That leaves us with:Did fred ever return the $4000 to his bank account??
If Fred was in fact giving Maura $4000,why would he?And for what?
Did she owe some tuition?but used it instead to leave?
why would he make up the car shopping stories?

Maruchan wrote:

<quoted text>
Jenkins, you spew so much on this thread that is simply untrue it's unbelievable. Most of the time, you add that your opinions are "fact" when they are simply not. This is one of them.
FACT: The full name of the "local" has been posted in this same thread on three occasions, twice outright and once reposted in a quote. On another site pertaining to MM, the name of the local is not mentioned, however they direct readers to one of those Topix posts where it IS mentioned and give the post number in the thread to easily locate it.
You are truly obtuse when you continue on proclaiming that no harm can come to a person who is outed on the Internet, with their real name and personal information, with speculation that they have MURDERED another human being.
How's this - since you can't comprehend how people might be damaged by having their personal information posted in a forum such as this, why don't you provide us all with your real name, address, phone number and email address and post a photograph of yourself? You're not being accused of murder, you're just a person posting on an anonymous forum, and surely don't have any reason to worry about releasing that information. You're just chatting, right? Kicking around ideas. Speculating on how lots of different people may have MURDERED Maura Murray. Just talk. You have nothing to fear, right? So why don't you post that personal information for all of us who respond here, and all the other thousands of people who lurk here, to see? OK? If you feel uncomfortable doing so, tell us why.
I'll bet Beagle can tell us why. His real name has been posted here, with lots of people here searching for his address, and posting his work location. His real photograph was posted on Renner's blog. He is a person that very obviously has some mental issues and probably needs some help. He claims to have been harassed by people involved in some way with MM. Don't you even have a clue as to why he uses "Phoebe Prince" as a nickname here? You have berated him over and over here, called him horrible names, speculated that HE killed MM - go read post #19075 here (can't find the original at the moment) where you have this to say, among other things: "He certainly deserves a serious looking at, or at least to get the shit kicked out of him. For the videos he's posted I've never seen anyone deserve a bigger ass-beating" and "Someone like that yur not Gonna make him feel bad by anything u write so that's why I suggest multiple beatings is what he deserves. Not saying I'm gonna do that(as much as I want to), but that's clearly what he deserves." His real name being posted here has been picked up and carried to other sites, where I see comments posted threatening him. Renner brought him to a much wider audience on Fox News, and impulsively speculated that he could have been involved in the murder of Melissa Jenkins prior to the actual murderers being identified. Think about if just ONE of the people reading all this shit about him is a psycho vigilante type who decides to take matters into his own hands, maybe doing what you recommend, kicking the shit out of him, or worse? Do you think that perhaps that has crossed Beagle's mind a few times? Do you think that might cause him a great deal of stress or fear? Especially when he appears to have a vulnerable state of mind?
Nobody has to list any incidents of harassment or damage. The psychological damage of having your real name associated with the possible murder of another human being is enough.

Thank you.

I really hate to say this but looking at Fred's actions
and statements it sure looks like maybe this has something to do with the Vasi hit and run.
There's more than a couple things that have been said that have turned out to just be flat out wrong.

It looks to me like he brought that 4 g's cash to give to maura to get the hell outta dodge until the heat dies down, does it not? Seems to me like he didn't want the public knowing about that loot and I'd bet you anything he's ripping pissed that Renner was able to obtain that written statement and release it to the public; sure made Fred look like a liar to anybody who's read that and has listened to Fred talk for the last years.

She refused to drive the car.
The car didn't even run!
It only ran on 3 cylinders
She got rides everywhere from her friends,
We almost had to have it towed to Amherst
The car was so bad we were buying a new one.

It just looks like they were trying to make it look like there was absolutely no way she was driving that car that weekend; why did they want to make it look like that?

Maura received a call shortly after Pertit Vasi got hit on triangle street, that brought her beyond tears; she was described as being in a catatonic state.
And then we have some more things said as fact that turned out not to be entirely true:
That her car had to be parked about a 10-15min walk from her job.
Her work was about 10min from where he got hit.
Therefore it would be impossible for her to hit him and not be noticed as gone from her work(her boss did rounds about every 30m)
Well these statements aren't exactly true. First of all her work was literally a 1-2min drive from triangle street where he got hit, its very close.
Also she was working at night. At night on the Umass campus you can basically park anywhere you want. As long as you don't leave your car overnight youa re not getting a ticket. Nobody parks in their proper spot at night if they're working or something.
Now this does not mean that Maura definetly drove her car to work that night, we really don't know if she did or not but if she did drive it to work she could have parked her car right outside of that dorm. She literally could have been parked about a 1-2 min walk.
Again, this does not mean it happened but she could've theorettically left work, got in her car and drove to where he got hit within 4 mins. SO that means if she did hit him she could've left work and been back at work within 10min. If she did cut out of work early she would've left right after her boss came around, thats what anybody would do. If she left work and did hit and run your damn sure she wouldve went straight back to work to give herself an alibi, would she not? So it is theoretically possible that she could have hit him and returned to work. DOesn't mean that she def did, but she could have.

As for the call she received I know that the family now says it came from her sister. But her sister says they talked around 10:30. We also have a statement from a Umass cop who says the call came in shortly after 1 and it was traced to another phone on campus. He specifically said that they know it came from on campus, but they have no way of knowing who was on the other end; it must have been from a phone in a common area.

So that means she received a call from somewhere on campus very soon after Petrit got hit that brought her to a catatonic state. I'm of the opinion that if the saturn was involved then its probably more likely that it was someone else driving the car, hence the phone call.

Nothing can be certain and we likely will never know who hit Vasi, but that would sure make sense out of some of these mistatements and actions by Fred and the family.
Is this why she actually left campus in such a rush?
Was Fred helping her get out of town? Is this what the 4 g's was for?
Did the accident mess everything up?

I dont want to say this definetly happened, It just seems like this could explain a lot of their actions.

I really don't think she owed any tuition; as far as we've been told she got scholoarships and financial aid.
(
Thats what I wonder, where is her financial aid refund check? When you get financial aid they give you extra money to pay for your apartment and living expenses. It starts at $3500(i think its 35) and goes up by about 500 every year. I think she was a junior that year technically so taht would mean she should've gotten about a 4500 refund check.
I always found the timing here interesting. At Umass you generally get your refund checks aboutt he first week of the semester, this always causes problems because everyon needs to have their housing before the semester starts but you don't get your refund to pay for it until about a week after.
Looking at the calender that monday the 9th was likely the day that the refunds got paid out that year(always seems to be a monday from what I've seen)....Did she get her refund check? Does this have something to do with her choice of leaving that day?

The only thing we know here for a fact is that there's no way in hell she was gonna be able to pay for a condo with $280, in fact she could barely even pay for a night considering you need to leave a deposit which is generally the cost of one night.

Besides, if Fred was giving her the 4 g's for tuition he would just give her a check. Also if that's what it was for I'm sure he would've told the umass cops that.