Maura Murray

JWB wrote:

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Advocate,Any thoughts as to who may have sent this information to Renner? Ben Franklins perhaps?

As far as I know, whoever sent it wished to remain confidential.

JWB wrote:

Is Ben Franklin - James leone ? a simple head nod is ok.

I couldn't say -- but we aren't giving people's real names on the forum anyhow, are we, so if I could say, I probably shouldn't, right?

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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Is it even legal to have posters join a site and then have someone trace their IP address to attempt to find their location or identity without their knowledge? If it is legal it shouldn't be IMO.
So advocator if what you say is true then mcsmom has given us another load of BS. Why try to blame Mason if he had nothing to do with it.

Yes, it's legal. A site owner needs to be able to track down hackers, report things like personal threats and the like if that becomes necessary. While a site owner can't go very far with an IP address, the owner can report it up the line to those who can take it further if there is sufficient need. And if for example a poster is being abusive and won't stop, the site owner can block that IP address which usually blocks that poster from posting.

The IP address doesn't tell a site owner the actual identity of the poster -- I believe the portion of IP address that is commonly shown only leads to the area of the server that the poster is using. For example, I think my IP address leads to Phoenix, but in fact I don't live in Phoenix, that's just where the server is that my computer routs to.

Mason is the purported high profile defense attorney correct?

So mcsmom- what your saying is that Mason was all bullshit right? He made some good points, I'm not talking about that, but his whole story about being a defense attorney was made up? His address was fake, does that mean he was a fake? Good point about him not being able to get his wife's case on that project. What was his wife's case btw? Was Fred leatherman even a real name or was that made up?

Was masons whole story all made up, frmLE style?? Did he get caught out in his lie?
His address was an empty lot. Lol, sounds about right.
His whole thing was weird, how much work he put in and then just stopped.

amy researches wrote:

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Thank you for clearing this up. I believed Citigirl when she said she did not make that post, but I didn't understand why it was assumed to be her just because two people posted from the same area. Did any of you ever find out who made the post about Maura running away? The post observer responded to?

I never heard -- I believe Ben Franklyn turned the information over to Lt. Scarinza in case LE would feel it should be looked into, I've never heard if Scarinza responded and have no idea whether or not LE paid any attention to it. It seemed a bit important at the time because the Geocities post and then "Observer"s support of it, sounded like either it might be true, or it might be a strong attempt at misdirection by someone, possibly even a guilty party in Maura's disappearance.

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

Mason is the purported high profile defense attorney correct?
So mcsmom- what your saying is that Mason was all bullshit right? He made some good points, I'm not talking about that, but his whole story about being a defense attorney was made up? His address was fake, does that mean he was a fake? Good point about him not being able to get his wife's case on that project. What was his wife's case btw? Was Fred leatherman even a real name or was that made up?
Was masons whole story all made up, frmLE style?? Did he get caught out in his lie?
His address was an empty lot. Lol, sounds about right.
His whole thing was weird, how much work he put in and then just stopped.

JMO, but I think Mason was who he said he was (or is). I didn't personally agree with his theory, but he brought other interesting points to the table. As far as I recall, he stopped posting as other things in his life were needing his time.

Advocator wrote:

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I couldn't say -- but we aren't giving people's real names on the forum anyhow, are we, so if I could say, I probably shouldn't, right?

That's ok Advocate- it is easy enough to connect the dots anyway.I was curious from the fact that Mason was questioned as to why he was on the Maura forum and living in KY while MR "L" aka "BF" looks like he lives in NJ.

Advocator wrote:

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Yes, it's legal. A site owner needs to be able to track down hackers, report things like personal threats and the like if that becomes necessary. While a site owner can't go very far with an IP address, the owner can report it up the line to those who can take it further if there is sufficient need. And if for example a poster is being abusive and won't stop, the site owner can block that IP address which usually blocks that poster from posting.
The IP address doesn't tell a site owner the actual identity of the poster -- I believe the portion of IP address that is commonly shown only leads to the area of the server that the poster is using. For example, I think my IP address leads to Phoenix, but in fact I don't live in Phoenix, that's just where the server is that my computer routs to.

I am no expert but I do believe everything you have stated to be 100% accurate.

The only way that you as an individual can tie a persons identity to their IP is to find say a document that they filled out with their real name and the same IP. Like an online purchase where they listed their name and address in the send to fields. That would tied the IP to their name BUT and I can't stress this enough, ALMOST ALL OF THOSE ARE NOW ENCRYPTED. And that encryption used in most cases is far beyond what most would be capable of decrypting so even that information is safe. And providing you didn't need to hack a site to find that information, it is all legal as far as I know. The other part I cant stress enough is how time consuming and you really would have to be a motivated psychopath to spend the amount of time this would require.

There are tools that can intercept IP packets looking for your specific IP to grab all your information (encrypted parts would still be encrypted though) but I doubt they could be used on a someones home computer with any success (it likely would have to be on the server you use, which means the IP provider would have to use it), but again, I'm not expert in this. Maybe Advocator has more insight? He may know more about this than I.

There might also be ways for a virus to be sent to your specific known IP for it to send back anything you do on your computer to the creator. I would think most of those would be identified by any decent anti virus software unless of course the virus is smart enough to first disable the anti-virus software to its presence. Again, you would need a very technically gifted, highly motivated, psychopath to accomplish this.

Bill

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

His address was an empty lot. Lol, sounds about right.

Uhhhhh. If you track my name down (my full fake name was recently outed in another forum, the horror :-o), in CT, you won't even find an empty lot. There is no way, I would let any of you know my real identity. All the information is real. But, WTF/WTH, the person, doesn't exist except as a ghost in the ether. While it might not be impossible to find me (by people on these forums), it would take a highly motivated, technically gifted, nut job to do it. That lets me sleep very soundly at night.

Bill

amy researches wrote:

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Thank you for clearing this up. I believed Citigirl when she said she did not make that post, but I didn't understand why it was assumed to be her just because two people posted from the same area. Did any of you ever find out who made the post about Maura running away? The post observer responded to?

As long as you follow up each post with questions to ask for proof of any posters "facts" you can't be misled regardless of their posting name. The only time you become misled is when people just take what the other person said as fact and not ask any follow up questions.

Tania Head started running an internet forum. No one asked even the smallest and most simple questions to debunk her story.

WTH-the-original wrote:

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Uhhhhh. If you track my name down (my full fake name was recently outed in another forum, the horror :-o), in CT, you won't even find an empty lot. There is no way, I would let any of you know my real identity. All the information is real. But, WTF/WTH, the person, doesn't exist except as a ghost in the ether. While it might not be impossible to find me (by people on these forums), it would take a highly motivated, technically gifted, nut job to do it. That lets me sleep very soundly at night.
Bill

Now you just ruined it!! You have resurfaced the pain of when I first learned that Santa Clause and Wrestling was fake,and now we learn there is no WTH. I am tired of the lies. I am mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore!

http://cigay.blogspot.com/2011/07/how-anonymo...

Lighthouse 101 wrote:

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As long as you follow up each post with questions to ask for proof of any posters "facts" you can't be misled regardless of their posting name. The only time you become misled is when people just take what the other person said as fact and not ask any follow up questions.
Tania Head started running an internet forum. No one asked even the smallest and most simple questions to debunk her story.

That is how I do it.

It is usually pretty easy to spot people who are full of s**t. I have repeatedly told people to not believe a word I say. Research it, see if it passes your own checks before you trust it. When I get answers to questions that I don't know are true, I check them. When a person repeatedly gives me answers I find are correct, eventually, I don't need to check those people anymore.

Bill

JFletcher wrote:

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Now you just ruined it!! You have resurfaced the pain of when I first learned that Santa Clause and Wrestling was fake,and now we learn there is no WTH. I am tired of the lies. I am mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore!

And just what do you mean by, "wrestling is fake"? ;-)

Bill

In short, there is no such thing as ‘anonymity’ on the web. It just depends on what extent the trackers are willing to go in order to track you. If they are not so serious about pursuing you, you could escape anonymously. But if they are willing to go to any extent in uncovering your identity, there are enough footprints you have left online and tools in their hands to track you.

All of course true but, he also has a doctorate in computer engineering. Most wouldn't find it that easy and like he said, they have to be pretty serious about finding out who you are. The ISP logs he mentioned are only available to the companies as far as I know. So again, it absolutely can be done, but it would take not an insignificant amount of time, effort, and knowledge to accomplish. Anything missing from that triad is likely to end in failure. Throw in using a anonymous server and most will be in very good shape though in most cases that is not even needed.

Bill

When it looked to me like I had been banned fro MMM forum back in 2008, Helena told me via email or phone to go to a page and she's see if my Ip was on the list. It wasn't and yet I couldn't access the forum.

To clarify, The page exposed my Ip and Helena was able to see that. I don't know how she could do the comparison, and to what she compared that info. But it sounds like what people are talking about here.
I know my email was taken and used to IM me by someone working closely on that forum, so private info can be gained when you have backround access.

mcsmom wrote:

Mason deviated in the extent of what he felt Fred was responsible for, outlined in his 18 red herrings.

Mason's red herrings were deduced by statements and actions of the parties involved. I find it interesting that he was able create the Red Herrings without anything more but statements and actions. All this was done before James Renner made it easy by getting first hand information.

Some of his points in my opinion (- MM leaving West Point not by her own choice - Not everything was great in her life - what possibly what went down in the hotel room - the aframe - the rusty knife- vassi - red truck )seem to have been deduced correctly.

I would actually like to hear an updated version of his Red Herrings with him using JR's reasearch.

Lighthouse 101 wrote:

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Mason's red herrings were deduced by statements and actions of the parties involved. I find it interesting that he was able create the Red Herrings without anything more but statements and actions. All this was done before James Renner made it easy by getting first hand information.
Some of his points in my opinion (- MM leaving West Point not by her own choice - Not everything was great in her life - what possibly what went down in the hotel room - the aframe - the rusty knife- vassi - red truck )seem to have been deduced correctly.
I would actually like to hear an updated version of his Red Herrings with him using JR's reasearch.

Please don't take Mcsmom off track. I am still waiting to hear who the haters are and why she labels them as such?

Bill

Advocator wrote:

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I never heard -- I believe Ben Franklyn turned the information over to Lt. Scarinza in case LE would feel it should be looked into, I've never heard if Scarinza responded and have no idea whether or not LE paid any attention to it. It seemed a bit important at the time because the Geocities post and then "Observer"s support of it, sounded like either it might be true, or it might be a strong attempt at misdirection by someone, possibly even a guilty party in Maura's disappearance.

Very interesting. Thanks for answering. Turning the info over to LE sounds like the responsible thing to do. If I owned a site and this happened on my site, I would turn the info to LE also.

The disturbing part to me is that it was posted on Renner's blog along with second-hand information revealing citigirl's supposed real name. If Ben did not intend to implicate citigirl in this, and this information is in fact false, then I hope he has written to Renner with a correction. Although I think it is ultimately Renner's responsibility to fact-check and not publish incorrect info in the first place, I also think it's rather mean to let the incorrect information sit there and not attempt to correct it before it appears in a book. Just my opinion.