Maura Murray

FM obviously loved going to NH, took the family there every summer presumably without encountering any problems. He arrives 36 hours after the disappearance in an emotional state himself. He recalls the recent stressors in her life -- car crash in Hadley,(alleged) lothario boyfriend, heavy school/work schedule. Because there was no apparent sign of a struggle you may not immediately suspect foul play (not in the idyllic mountains that you enjoyed so much) and might throw out any possible explanation in order to find your daughter. Recent conversations, private jokes, favorite hiking spots. Anything.

In cases where there is no perceived crime scene at the departure point the police and family will cover all bases by appealing to the disappeared via a press conference.

Unless there's any evidence to the contrary, for me, Maura's misadventure starts with a previously unknown predator who is in a Red Truck with a MA truck or reasonable facsimile.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
I once was the driver in a friends car that we towed with a rope about 20 miles. We moved around 25 mph and it was the most nerve wracking experience I remember. Try being 8 or 10 or maybe 15 feet away from a vehicle at 25 mph and not hitting them when they go to stop and all the turning when driving. This was with a much older car. One that you could actually attach the rope or chain to the bumper.
I would still like to hear DC tell us where to attach a chain or rope to a Saturn for towing.
Bill

You cannot tow a vehicle that way UNLESS there is a person in it to steer and control the car.

On a 1996 Saturn there is no tow hook on the front of the car or a place to screw one in on some cars.

The saturn has a solid stabilizer bar that runs from the front end steering and A-Frame section of the car and runs parallel to the front of the car. This is easily found by laying on the ground at the front of the car and looking just behind the front spoiler and the plastic guard. It is right there and easy to hook a tow strap or chain to.

Although this is not the correct way to tow this vehicle...It can be done. There is a possibility of damaging this stabilizer link but I don't think this was a concern.

"Scuse me ma'am could I crawl under your bonnet look at your stabilizer bar?"

Local news headline: Local sports imprint of granny's Dexter deck shoe on forehead.

NO...I don't think I know a guy named Buckshot. I do live in Littleton but that name I have never come across to My knowledge.

What a bunch of Smart-asses we have here. Grow up people!!!

NHwoodsman52 wrote:

<quoted text>
The irony of this is, it seems an ominous statement, there may have been a death, HER OWN!!
Makes me wonder a little more about her state of mind, but still I don't feel suicide was her plan though it may have crossed her mind before leaving Amherst and may have been a stronger thought after the Swiftwater accident.

Very good point. Or, further on that thought, if she was strongly considering starting a new life or definitely had that plan, and did not intend to contact her family again and explain herself or her whereabouts, that again to her family (and others) would be "a death". We can't ignore the fact that her father put out a plea to her very early on that whatever she thought was wrong, they'd fix it. And that her younger brother wrote a poem asking what she was angry about.

Frostman wrote:

"Scuse me ma'am could I crawl under your bonnet look at your stabilizer bar?"
Local news headline: Local sports imprint of granny's Dexter deck shoe on forehead.

Is that You George....?

NHwoodsman52 wrote:

<quoted text>
Old about 5" 5''ish, thin, that's what he looked liked 20 years ago and I am sure his hair is white if he still has any. He's been a resident of the area I believe all his life. He's got to be in his 70's. Trust me if you met him you'd remember, I haven't seen him in years but a family relative said he was still alive last year.

Why are You asking about this. Does it have anything to do with this case.?

Det Columbo wrote:

<quoted text>
Is that You George....?

Not George. No previous incarnations on this or any other MM threads. Just kind of segued my way from the Ray Gricar case to Renner's blog and then here. I was doing some research on a writing project and the Disappeared show popped up my "YouTube has selected this for your viewing enjoyment" list. This is great for writer's block and cheaper than retail therapy.

Maybe the story here is the interactions of a dysfunctional cyber family. Maybe we can find someone to financially back a conference so we can all sleuth it out face to face in the meeting room at a ski resort... Agatha Christie style. Ten Little Indians. Of course it would have to be in MA as SnowyB is determined to not set foot outside The Commonwealth.

Not sure the George reference is a compliment.:)

Frostman....

Just thought You were someone I know personally. Sorry. No harm meant.

aftermath wrote:

Your continuing to shut people down, works to ensure no new information will ever come in.

There is no information forthcoming and hasn’t been for years. The person you can thank for that more than anyone else, if there actually is anymore information out there is Shack. Snowey, Wowzer and I are likely the reason that if there was anyone who was going to bring forth any information, it is because they don’t know about Shack and a few others and aren’t worried they would be pilloried online like others were.

aftermath wrote:

There are other ways of thinking, Bill.

There really aren’t. Do you ever wonder when cops go to cop school, courses in psychics and “fiction writing for success” aren’t in their course load? Beacause they have no use in a logical mind when pursuing the facts.

What you call “other ways of thinking” I call guessing and fantasy. There are several established facts about this case and no more. There is a finite and very small number of things that could have happened in broad strokes. Deviation from those possibilities is not thinking, it is imagining or guessing and doesn’t add to the discussion, it distracts from the discussion. Until new evidence appears we are stuck with a mystery. Listening to the unicorns might make for good fictions stories but it does nothing to help solve what happened that night.

Bill

Det Columbo wrote:

Frostman....
Just thought You were someone I know personally. Sorry. No harm meant.

None taken!

Det Columbo wrote:

<quoted text>You cannot tow a vehicle that way UNLESS there is a person in it to steer and control the car.

I thought that part was understood when I explained how nerve wracking it was to drive the towed car and why?

Det Columbo wrote:

<quoted text>The saturn has a solid stabilizer bar that runs from the front end steering and A-Frame section of the car and runs parallel to the front of the car.

I will try to check this out but given where the stabilizer bar is located I would tend to believe that there would be serious damage to the bumper from towing in that manner. So I will hold my utter disbelief until I can check it out further but, color me very, very, skeptical that it can be done in that manner without clear evidence like the bumper being torn off or heavy damage under the bumper. Some damage like that might also look like the damage created by loading on a flatbed since they usually attach their hooks on similar points to pull onto a flatbed. Is there damage like that, that you are assuming is caused by towing and it is instead from being pulled onto a flatbed?

Bill

Det Columbo wrote:

NO...I don't think I know a guy named Buckshot. I do live in Littleton but that name I have never come across to My knowledge.

They call him Buckshot because he shakes so much.

Det Columbo wrote:

What a bunch of Smart-asses we have here. Grow up people!!!

Jeesh Mr Columbo where is your sense of humour? I though Frostman's joke was a riot and it actually made me LOL.
I will refer to post #7929 every time I feel a bout of stress starting. Thanks Frostman!!!

avec plaisir

aftermath wrote:

<quoted text>
jwb,
To say it is very odd is an understatement. This does not sound like something Fred would say.... In my opinion, Fred as well as many others, were much more interested in where some guy had been for approximately two hours. I recall Fred asking that question on a number of occasions.... As far as I know, Fred's question was never answered. Why? How would an answer to Fred's question harm an investigation?

Are you saying that you know Fred and have talked to him? How else would you know that it doesn't sound like something he'd say. How long have you known him? When did Fred and the many others tell you that they were much more interested in where some guy had been for two hours?
Someone was asking not long ago if anyone knew where the story of that two hour lapse originated from. Going back it seems that Fred might be the originater of it. Does anyone know positively?
Oh and the "old squaw walk" has been mentioned by him more than once.

Frostman wrote:

<quoted text>
Not George. No previous incarnations on this or any other MM threads. Just kind of segued my way from the Ray Gricar case to Renner's blog and then here. I was doing some research on a writing project and the Disappeared show popped up my "YouTube has selected this for your viewing enjoyment" list. This is great for writer's block and cheaper than retail therapy.
Maybe the story here is the interactions of a dysfunctional cyber family. Maybe we can find someone to financially back a conference so we can all sleuth it out face to face in the meeting room at a ski resort... Agatha Christie style. Ten Little Indians. Of course it would have to be in MA as SnowyB is determined to not set foot outside The Commonwealth.
Not sure the George reference is a compliment.:)

Like maybe a new reality show?

Completely unrelated to the current discussion here, but here goes:

Was it ever made absolutely and unequivocally clear that the "mystery" girl "Raykel" as seen and spoken to in the Barton, VT, church was not Maura in "disguise".
"Raykel´s" running away when the priest started his Fathers´ Day sermon has always made me wonder....

Frostman wrote:

<quoted text>
Not George. No previous incarnations on this or any other MM threads. Just kind of segued my way from the Ray Gricar case to Renner's blog and then here. I was doing some research on a writing project and the Disappeared show popped up my "YouTube has selected this for your viewing enjoyment" list. This is great for writer's block and cheaper than retail therapy.
Maybe the story here is the interactions of a dysfunctional cyber family. Maybe we can find someone to financially back a conference so we can all sleuth it out face to face in the meeting room at a ski resort... Agatha Christie style. Ten Little Indians. Of course it would have to be in MA as SnowyB is determined to not set foot outside The Commonwealth.
Not sure the George reference is a compliment.:)

right. and my recent experiences with VT have cinched the deal; waaayyy too liberal.

"Maybe the story here is the interactions of a dysfunctional cyber family." ~ Frosty

well, you're a little late to the party....you missed the most bizarre levels of dysfunction some time ago. there was a magic show (the Topix threads appeared and disappeared), psychics, dueling lawyers (one real, one pretend), a CC instructor / or was that college professor?, and occasional flirting. still, i don't think you'll be disappointed.