Maura Murray

I think ross had some good points- nobody knows but maura what happened it it is very frustrating to all. No new facts lately! what happened to renner? no books sold? beagle threats? IDK- to many holes for us to fill in. We all have different scenarios and that is fine right? Otherwise there would be zero conversation about Maura.

There is something that draws us all here. A common thread that we are not sure why. Is it the young vibrant girl that went missing in your area etc...Or the Young girl that is old enough to be your daughter?

lets not forget why this forum was started. Yea it gets off track etc.. but bottom line is maura is Mising and that brought us here (one would hope).

keep the faith that she will be brought home to her family.

So I read back page 98+,Local LE just wants this to go away because its a prominent family,Wouldnt the FBI listen to what Billwood has to say?It ALL rings true..
And I noticed the hidden agenda crowd jumped all ovr him...

mcsmom wrote:

As far as an alcoholic smell, GHB has no odor, so hard to rule anything based on that, one way or the other. This alcohol could have been at the Sat nite party as well, and the Carolla crash with the possible absence of ETOH smell could lend some credence to the dismissive dui action on the part of Amherst LE. Even Scarinza finds this puzzling.
Secondly, a poster recently raised the question of the red truck and the troubled suicidal youth, linking them by suggesting the truck was searching for this kid.
IMO, if the truck stopped at the Stagestop Store and waited in the parking lot for a period of time, it would only make sense that someone from the truck would have gone in and checked with WM and or asked RO if they had seen this kid. I doubt the red truck was complicit with the youth either.
Lastly, I do recall seeing a post from Sharon in the old MMM forum where in fact she said the Red Cross did have Billy's cell phone number after all.

Hi MCSMOM - As I stated in my earlier post a former aquaintance was employed by Becket School & thats why I recognized the name in the log. We'd talked about his job, his duties & the school. He often worked the night shift & for the most part his shift was uneventful. However some nights were difficult. To quote their website "The Becket Family of Services specializes in working with youth who present extreme behavioral challenges" http://www.becket.org/who-we-serve/ . Which explains the need for 24/7 staffing. It also explains the need for possitive public perception. From everything my friend told me the school did an excellent job & were highly professional. However, in many of our small New England towns there can be oposition, concern &/or reluctance to allow or accept this type of facility into their community. We had a similar facility across the river in VT that chose to locate in a town without zoning in part to avoid possible opposition from the community. This is why I don't believe the Becket school would stop and ask random strangers or WM at the local convenient store "hey have you seen this kid that ran off?" I believe the school would choose to handle it in a professional manner, as discreetly as possible.

I was suggesting a possibility there could be a link based on an estimated timing of the youth's disapearance and a known time of the youth's location. Again it's not clear how the youth left the work detail, how long the school searched, where they searched or how he came to be on Lime Kiln Rd. If (little word, big meaning) the Becket School was searching for the youth in and around the area of Maura's crash at or about the same time of the crash IMO it would be helpful to know this. I ask myself who would notice more? Someone driving through the area on their way to a particular destination OR Someone driving through the area actively searching for someone? I ask myself "if" the youth was trying to run away at or around the same time as Maura's accident in & around the same area, could this explain some of the Maura sightings that seem odd or our of character further complicating the search for Maura?

Is there a way to "scan" cement???

dll wrote:

<quoted text>
Hi MCSMOM - As I stated in my earlier post a former aquaintance was employed by Becket School & thats why I recognized the name in the log. We'd talked about his job, his duties & the school. He often worked the night shift & for the most part his shift was uneventful. However some nights were difficult. To quote their website "The Becket Family of Services specializes in working with youth who present extreme behavioral challenges" http://www.becket.org/who-we-serve/ . Which explains the need for 24/7 staffing. It also explains the need for possitive public perception. From everything my friend told me the school did an excellent job & were highly professional. However, in many of our small New England towns there can be oposition, concern &/or reluctance to allow or accept this type of facility into their community. We had a similar facility across the river in VT that chose to locate in a town without zoning in part to avoid possible opposition from the community. This is why I don't believe the Becket school would stop and ask random strangers or WM at the local convenient store "hey have you seen this kid that ran off?" I believe the school would choose to handle it in a professional manner, as discreetly as possible.
I was suggesting a possibility there could be a link based on an estimated timing of the youth's disapearance and a known time of the youth's location. Again it's not clear how the youth left the work detail, how long the school searched, where they searched or how he came to be on Lime Kiln Rd. If (little word, big meaning) the Becket School was searching for the youth in and around the area of Maura's crash at or about the same time of the crash IMO it would be helpful to know this. I ask myself who would notice more? Someone driving through the area on their way to a particular destination OR Someone driving through the area actively searching for someone? I ask myself "if" the youth was trying to run away at or around the same time as Maura's accident in & around the same area, could this explain some of the Maura sightings that seem odd or our of character further complicating the search for Maura?

Didn't this occur after Maura's accident when CS was called away well after 9pm? How can this be related at all.
thank you

findmaura wrote:

Is there a way to "scan" cement???

yep but you need a search warrent

JWB..Check your email...Mole??WTF dude..

Lymn kiln road and maura to connect the two just doesn't fit for several reasons.

1)time

2) location

30 sex

dll wrote:

<quoted text>
Hi MCSMOM - As I stated in my earlier post a former aquaintance was employed by Becket School & thats why I recognized the name in the log. We'd talked about his job, his duties & the school. He often worked the night shift & for the most part his shift was uneventful. However some nights were difficult. To quote their website "The Becket Family of Services specializes in working with youth who present extreme behavioral challenges" http://www.becket.org/who-we-serve/ . Which explains the need for 24/7 staffing. It also explains the need for possitive public perception. From everything my friend told me the school did an excellent job & were highly professional. However, in many of our small New England towns there can be oposition, concern &/or reluctance to allow or accept this type of facility into their community. We had a similar facility across the river in VT that chose to locate in a town without zoning in part to avoid possible opposition from the community. This is why I don't believe the Becket school would stop and ask random strangers or WM at the local convenient store "hey have you seen this kid that ran off?" I believe the school would choose to handle it in a professional manner, as discreetly as possible.
I was suggesting a possibility there could be a link based on an estimated timing of the youth's disapearance and a known time of the youth's location. Again it's not clear how the youth left the work detail, how long the school searched, where they searched or how he came to be on Lime Kiln Rd. If (little word, big meaning) the Becket School was searching for the youth in and around the area of Maura's crash at or about the same time of the crash IMO it would be helpful to know this. I ask myself who would notice more? Someone driving through the area on their way to a particular destination OR Someone driving through the area actively searching for someone? I ask myself "if" the youth was trying to run away at or around the same time as Maura's accident in & around the same area, could this explain some of the Maura sightings that seem odd or our of character further complicating the search for Maura?

I can fully understand the school wanting to avoid any repercussions regarding the circumstances that night. As the parent of this boy, I would have questioned the events leading to the LK incident. Looking for him before placing a 911 call was the likely scenario. At the same time it does not fully explain the behavior of the red truck occupant(s). A quick walk thru of the Stage Stop would have been sufficient. If JKM was looking for him prior to the 911 call, then maybe that explains why he remains to this day without comment.
It raises some interesting questions in my mind.

jldross wrote:

<quoted text>
What if she planned to follow through with calling her dad that night at 8:00 and wanted to leave them behind to not let him down? Suicide isn't the most rational thing so I don't dismiss the idea just because she had the forms or carried a toothbrush or had school books in her car. Like JW said we don't know but it's another possibility. Thanks for posting the pages, I'm reading through it.

Suicide is the most irrational concept for any person. Our World is based on survival of the fittest. Any and every animal is suppossed to survive so when we end our life it is completely irrational.

Usually when people decide to end their life it is a quick decision.(irrational not thought out). She could have been completely fine and forgot about her troubles until she crashed again.

I think it is much easier to accept the fact that someone murdered her, rather than she killed herself, and they couldn't help her. Or maybe the family went hard on her for her second cc fraud charge and her crashing her fathers car.

Its only natural for family to go hard on someone for those mistakes. Now maybe they feel that because they went hard on her she ran away crashed again and ended it.

I also think that if you look at the way this case is presented to people. The ID show makes no mention of the cc fraud, the west point expulsion or any other negative aspect of her life. I haven't researched all the ID stories, but this is the only story that I can see where the family leaves out anything negative about the missing. I think even Brianna Maitland's story makes mention of her history of possible drug use. What this shows me is I think they want to keep her in such a positive light that they don't want to look at the negative implication of suicide. They rather look and deal with it as a murder.

The last point I would like to make is the father's reaction. She was suppossed to call you at 8:00 PM the night before. She never called you. Whether or not you tried to reach her we don't know, but if you tried to call her you wouldn't have made contact.
Her car is found 180 or so miles away from where you thought your daughter is. You would be concerned. He drives the 3-4 hours to get up to NH. In those 3-4 hours he can think of any and every possible scenario that may be happening. Murder, Kidnap, locked in someone basement, slave trade. Anything should and could go through his head. He meets with LE and says "Squawalk"

Would that be the first thing for anyone to say to LE unless they knew that she was very troubled? I think if any father would have said "She's missing lets find her she could be in harms way" That doesn't happen here.

Lighthouse 101 wrote:

<quoted text>
Suicide is the most irrational concept for any person. Our World is based on survival of the fittest. Any and every animal is suppossed to survive so when we end our life it is completely irrational.
Usually when people decide to end their life it is a quick decision.(irrational not thought out). She could have been completely fine and forgot about her troubles until she crashed again.

Absolutely incorrect. Many suicides are rational. Often it is someone who is terminal and often fears either being a burden to their family and/or dying in extreme pain. Suicide can be a rational act to a situation that is untenable. And obviously the pain does not have to always be physical. Often suicide is a way to end whatever pain they are feeling, perceived or real.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Absolutely incorrect. Many suicides are rational. Often it is someone who is terminal and often fears either being a burden to their family and/or dying in extreme pain. Suicide can be a rational act to a situation that is untenable. And obviously the pain does not have to always be physical. Often suicide is a way to end whatever pain they are feeling, perceived or real.
Bill

Maybe we are looking at this in a different angle. I'm saying humans and all animals first instict is to survive. Maybe suicides are rational created in the victims mind.

The rational to people comes off completely irrational, hence the reason we see it as a tragedy. To Junior Seau maybe it made sense in his mind to do what he did, but when you heard it in the news did you look at what he did and say " I can totally see why this Hall of Fame athlete with so much money is going to live the rest of his life surfing should have killed himself?" We see it as irrational. Therefore we can't make sense of actions done before the event of the suicide.

I guess you may speaking from the rationality of the victim, and I'm looking at it from the irrationality of the observers.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Absolutely incorrect. Many suicides are rational. Often it is someone who is terminal and often fears either being a burden to their family and/or dying in extreme pain. Suicide can be a rational act to a situation that is untenable. And obviously the pain does not have to always be physical. Often suicide is a way to end whatever pain they are feeling, perceived or real.
Bill

Slightly OT, but that reminds me of an excellent book I read a year or so ago: "An Exclusive Love, A Memoir" by Johanna Adorjan. I picked it up for the historical information and also because it is superbly penned, but the foundation of the story is about a fascinating couple (based on a true story) who rationally set about to terminate their days on earth.

Lighthouse 101 wrote:

<quoted text>
I guess you may speaking from the rationality of the victim, and I'm looking at it from the irrationality of the observers.

I understand what you are saying and agree that the survival instinct is remarkably strong in all living things. But even as an observer, I have seen suicides that I have considered to be a rational act considering the circumstances that they found themselves in. Still sad, but in my mind, certainly not irrational.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
I understand what you are saying and agree that the survival instinct is remarkably strong in all living things. But even as an observer, I have seen suicides that I have considered to be a rational act considering the circumstances that they found themselves in. Still sad, but in my mind, certainly not irrational.
Bill

. Can you name some of these suicides? Dates, names , how you knew them...I'm calling bullshit. I've read your responses here... You seem to be an expert on all matters...especially the art of blowing smoke up the asses of topix junkies.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Absolutely incorrect. Many suicides are rational. Often it is someone who is terminal and often fears either being a burden to their family and/or dying in extreme pain. Suicide can be a rational act to a situation that is untenable. And obviously the pain does not have to always be physical. Often suicide is a way to end whatever pain they are feeling, perceived or real.
Bill

Yes many suicides are well thought out and planned rationally but I wouldn't have a reason to think this is the case for Maura. If suicide is what happened I think it was spurred by crashing her dads car and feeling she let everyone down. If the dad didn't know about the credit card fraud yet or that she might be kicked out of school she was then probably more upset than he knew at the time.

Maura maybe thought it over enough to pack up her room and leave the old email from her BF on the boxes, return scrubs to a student, bring a few sentimental belongings like the stuffed animal along. At that point when she was looking for directions and accommodations for a night she didn't have an exact rational plan. In rational suicide as you speak about it is not a spur of the moment thing but something the terminally ill person puts a good deal of thought behind.

Maura might have arrived to Bartlet and found a condo then thought it over that night and changed her mind. But then the last crash happened and sealed the deal, adding more of what she felt was insurmountable trouble to her full plate of problems that would ruin the future she worked for and let her dad down again.

I'm not blaming the father but any parent would blame themselves to a degree, and if the family is religious and doesn't believe in suicide that could factor in also to the denial. No one wants to believe their child is dead until they see the body, and none want to admit their child is permanently gone over a temporary problem.

If you've never felt that desperate and hopeless to want to end it all then it won't seem rational but in the mind of the person it feels like the best solution. It's tragic if this happened because she had her whole life in front of her and her family might have been temporarily angry or disappointed but later would forgive and support her.

Tickle pits wrote:

<quoted text>. Can you name some of these suicides? Dates, names , how you knew them...I'm calling bullshit. I've read your responses here... You seem to be an expert on all matters...especially the art of blowing smoke up the asses of topix junkies.

Of course not, you moron. For three reasons. One HIPPA laws don't allow me to do it, our department policies don't allow me to do it and just as important, that information would lead you to me. That isn't going to happen either. One of the stupidest attempts ever to try to find out who I am.

My suggestion to you, aside from you pounding sand up your ass, is to check on what I say. Don't believe a word of it. I have always recommended that no one believe a word I say. Check out what I say with other resources. Then, after you have learned something, tell me what you know. I mean, I could ask you to tell me everything you know now, I can listen for ten seconds since that is all the time it would take. After people check out what I write I also suggest they check out what you write, if anything.

And I am not an expert on all matters, but clearly you are disturbed by the fact that I apparently know more that you, on matters posted about here. Sorry, your not feeling the love or worse yet, maybe you are feeling insignificant.

Oh, I have put you on my pay no mind list. Basically that means you are not smart enough to be responded to or your comments are such hyperbole that you are not to be worried about. I suspect others will recognize that as well.

So come back with another name.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
I understand what you are saying and agree that the survival instinct is remarkably strong in all living things. But even as an observer, I have seen suicides that I have considered to be a rational act considering the circumstances that they found themselves in. Still sad, but in my mind, certainly not irrational.
Bill

From what we know about Maura would you say rational or irrational?

Lighthouse 101 wrote:

<quoted text>
From what we know about Maura would you say rational or irrational?

Personally. Based upon the information that we keep finding out. I think she was on the edge, possibly already despondent about the direction her life was headed as she saw it. She may have been heading there to commit suicide or to try to sort out her life. This crash could have easily tipped her to a suicidal state if she wasn't already. More things that she would have to try to explain to family, friends, and workers. Remember Fred's refrain, "we can work out whatever is the matter" or words to that effect. Was that about specifics he was aware of? The leaving with a large lie. The crash with booze. The running from the scene and all the other things that have lead up to this. If she was already suicidal, I doubt that this goal driven kid would have let a little crashed car stop her.

Bill

Bill, yes. And Kathleen's "she might think she is in trouble, but we just want her to come back, she is the best" or words to that effect.