Maura Murray

Yeah my best guess judging by the gas gauge would be she got gas just off of 91 on 302 at P&J's Truck Stop. If she had driven that distance from Amherst her gas tank would have been around a quarter of a tank or less remaining. As her drive was at the very least 150 miles long, and a 2 1/2 hour drive. That as someone would like to believe would not leave a half a tank of gas, in an ideal world it would though. Gas mileage is guesstimated and based off going a set mph as specified for highway mileage it is determined by going 55mph, and on a flat surface. Now bring in all the mountains and hills she had to go up and down and you are burning even more gas, they also don't take into account the fact that for some reason when your gas gauge hits half a tank it seems to go down a lot quicker, and that also does not include if she made any stops along the way and left her car idling to keep warm. What time did she leave Amherst does anyone know?

Bill 05478 wrote:

Yeah my best guess judging by the gas gauge would be she got gas just off of 91 on 302 at P&J's Truck Stop. If she had driven that distance from Amherst her gas tank would have been around a quarter of a tank or less remaining. As her drive was at the very least 150 miles long, and a 2 1/2 hour drive. That as someone would like to believe would not leave a half a tank of gas, in an ideal world it would though. Gas mileage is guesstimated and based off going a set mph as specified for highway mileage it is determined by going 55mph, and on a flat surface. Now bring in all the mountains and hills she had to go up and down and you are burning even more gas, they also don't take into account the fact that for some reason when your gas gauge hits half a tank it seems to go down a lot quicker, and that also does not include if she made any stops along the way and left her car idling to keep warm. What time did she leave Amherst does anyone know?

if i had to guess, i'd say Vasi theory or a truck stop theory. wild guesses, for sure. good info about a specific truck stop.

On the subject of the gas gauge. I found the same instrument cluster when I researched this. It looks like the gauge does indeed look to be registering near full. Which strikes me as odd for two reasons. First, most gauges of that time (I thought) were electrical and only registered correctly when switched on. I know one person here if she is of a mind can answer that. If that type of gauge is reading near full when it was off then this may simply be that the gauge stuck in that position because of the accident, maybe. Along with the myriad of problems reported about Maura's car, does anyone know if her gas gauge didn't work, possibly even before the accident? Just some thoughts of mine, don't know the answers.

Bill

Bill 05478 wrote:

Yeah my best guess judging by the gas gauge would be she got gas just off of 91 on 302 at P&J's Truck Stop. If she had driven that distance from Amherst her gas tank would have been around a quarter of a tank or less remaining. As her drive was at the very least 150 miles long, and a 2 1/2 hour drive. That as someone would like to believe would not leave a half a tank of gas, in an ideal world it would though. Gas mileage is guesstimated and based off going a set mph as specified for highway mileage it is determined by going 55mph, and on a flat surface. Now bring in all the mountains and hills she had to go up and down and you are burning even more gas, they also don't take into account the fact that for some reason when your gas gauge hits half a tank it seems to go down a lot quicker, and that also does not include if she made any stops along the way and left her car idling to keep warm. What time did she leave Amherst does anyone know?

Hi Bill, I really do think the pictures are correct, that wasn't what got me to post. Long ago there was talk about why and where Maura would be getting gas for it to be like that. Someone else with a Saturn gave their idea of what they got for miliage. It was very good as I recall, and a bit more than 30. So I started to think why would Maura feel the need to get more gas if she was headed to Stowe or the suspected, since it's only about 70 more miles and she would have gotten gas before she started out....... That car just sat. I doubt it had a full tank, it was towed back to Amherst, it stalled for Maura at the store, and then she was afraid to drive it, so she didn't. My problem or gift is that I can see all sides of something and Snowy's right, there are too many what ifs. From what you wrote, I do agree now that she would have had to stop in order to pour this wine into her bottle. I guess it hardly matters though. She could have poured it in there before she started out between 3:30 and 4:30, when a dorm mate saw her leave campus. Because she did something from her room at 4:00, I think she left just after checking her messages in her room. And what about those "scrubs"? Did she just put them outside the door or did this person see her on Monday when she returned that borrowed coat? I have to run, too busy all day and I would love to rewrite this because it's all jumbled up and I just hate that, but oh well

WTH-the-original wrote:

On the subject of the gas gauge. I found the same instrument cluster when I researched this. It looks like the gauge does indeed look to be registering near full. Which strikes me as odd for two reasons. First, most gauges of that time (I thought) were electrical and only registered correctly when switched on. I know one person here if she is of a mind can answer that. If that type of gauge is reading near full when it was off then this may simply be that the gauge stuck in that position because of the accident, maybe. Along with the myriad of problems reported about Maura's car, does anyone know if her gas gauge didn't work, possibly even before the accident? Just some thoughts of mine, don't know the answers.
Bill

I sold cars for over 20 years Bill and I sold a lot of GM products and early on with the electrical gas gauges they would indeed go down but not all the way as some may think, just a bit in fact. Just an observation I have made over the years of selling cars which I have not done for almost 3 years now. I hope this helps a little.

WTH-the-original wrote:

On the subject of the gas gauge. I found the same instrument cluster when I researched this. It looks like the gauge does indeed look to be registering near full. Which strikes me as odd for two reasons. First, most gauges of that time (I thought) were electrical and only registered correctly when switched on. I know one person here if she is of a mind can answer that. If that type of gauge is reading near full when it was off then this may simply be that the gauge stuck in that position because of the accident, maybe. Along with the myriad of problems reported about Maura's car, does anyone know if her gas gauge didn't work, possibly even before the accident? Just some thoughts of mine, don't know the answers.
Bill

Sorry Bil I forgot to put in the other answer to your question that yes it is quite possible that the gas gauge would stick in that position upon impact as well, which would indicate how much gas was in her tank as well. But, on another note the speedo usually would do this as well.

Bill 05478 wrote:

<quoted text>
Sorry Bil I forgot to put in the other answer to your question that yes it is quite possible that the gas gauge would stick in that position upon impact as well, which would indicate how much gas was in her tank as well. But, on another note the speedo usually would do this as well.

I thought the same about the speedo and tach also sticking but they are bigger heavier needles so I am not sure.

I know in aircraft crash investigations to determine what the instruments were reading at the time of the crash they usually examine the face of the dial to see where the needles scraped the face of the dial at the time of the impact, not where the needle wound up which often was snapped off. Of course in this crash I doubt the dynamics were high enough for that. I may be wrong but I thought that it was established that she did get fuel somewhere along the trip.

Like I said before, I have more question than answers.

Bill

here is a good page to learn about MPG ratings:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/factors.shtml

This also shows MPG's for MM's car if she was operating in an ideal situation.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorComp...

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
I thought the same about the speedo and tach also sticking but they are bigger heavier needles so I am not sure.
I know in aircraft crash investigations to determine what the instruments were reading at the time of the crash they usually examine the face of the dial to see where the needles scraped the face of the dial at the time of the impact, not where the needle wound up which often was snapped off. Of course in this crash I doubt the dynamics were high enough for that. I may be wrong but I thought that it was established that she did get fuel somewhere along the trip.
Like I said before, I have more question than answers.
Bill

I agree there are more questions than answers in this case, but if they established she got fuel somewhere then there should be video of her or her car, and if she paid cash she either would have been video taped or seen. But none of this has come out to the best of my knowledge. Which could only lead to speculation that either someone was with her or she was not even in the car anymore by this time. Now I am not sure that at this time that vehicles were capable of having the passenger side airbag automatically shut off when someone is not sitting in the passenger seat or if someone under a certain weight. This is a feature on vehicles now. I will have to do research on that now as well, seeing how both airbags deployed.

I got my answer and no they do not shut off.

Bill 05478 wrote:

<quoted text>
How could she leave the store around 8 when the accident happened between 7 and 7:30? The first 911 call came in at 7:29, this is after FW saw her car and drove home to call. SBD saw her prior to FW as well, maybe as much as 10 minutes prior to FW. Just saying and my kids who are now all grown have lived there since 1997. I can only go by what they tell me as far as the store hours.

Bill05478, The poster is someone who went to the store around 7 and saw the trooper she knew and also a truck that went by and slowed to apparently check her out. She went to the store and visited and left when it was closing. Is this clearer?

Anne wrote:

<quoted text>Bill05478, The poster is someone who went to the store around 7 and saw the trooper she knew and also a truck that went by and slowed to apparently check her out. She went to the store and visited and left when it was closing. Is this clearer?

Not really only because my kids have lived there for 13 years and that is a store they do frequent because it was walking distance from their house, so I think they would know the hours of the store better than even myself. If I could see the actual posting you are talking about maybe that would help. I'm also going to call my ex-wife and oldest son to see if they can find out for certain.

Anne wrote:

<quoted text>Bill05478, The poster is someone who went to the store around 7 and saw the trooper she knew and also a truck that went by and slowed to apparently check her out. She went to the store and visited and left when it was closing. Is this clearer?

Anne, I think he took it as you saying Maura left the store at 8:00?

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
now, why would you make such a statement without verifying it? Bill has twice refuted this claim....but you just drop it and leave it.

Regarding the opening hours of the Stage Stop Store in Swiftwater back in 2004, I seem to recall that the Red Truck witness Robinson Ordway said that she came into the store some time around 7 p.m. and then stayed there for quite some time.

Sara wrote:

<quoted text>
Anne, I think he took it as you saying Maura left the store at 8:00?

Yes Sara I was.

Euroobserver wrote:

<quoted text>
Regarding the opening hours of the Stage Stop Store in Swiftwater back in 2004, I seem to recall that the Red Truck witness Robinson Ordway said that she came into the store some time around 7 p.m. and then stayed there for quite some time.

Like I said I have a call into my family over there to have them find out there hours for sure.

Anne wrote:

<quoted text>Bill05478, The poster is someone who went to the store around 7 and saw the trooper she knew and also a truck that went by and slowed to apparently check her out. She went to the store and visited and left when it was closing. Is this clearer?

Was this the same trooper who showed up on the scene but did nothing at that time? Did she ever give a description of the red truck and which direction it was traveling? This might be helpful because the person I spoke of several days ago had a red truck at that time. His family also owns a business (The Railyard Racquet & Health Club) directly across from one of the gas stations I spoke of yesterday. Not pointing fingers though I am sure that LE is already following up on what I gave them.

Hours for the store.
Basic Info
.Location:533 Wild Ammonoosuc Road
03740.Detailed Info
.Mon - Thurs:6:00 am - 8:00 pmFri:6:00 am - 9:00 pmSat:7:00 am - 9:00 pmSun:7:00 am - 8:00 amLocation:533 Wild Ammonoosuc Road
03740.

Bill 05478 wrote:

<quoted text>
Was this the same trooper who showed up on the scene but did nothing at that time? Did she ever give a description of the red truck and which direction it was traveling? This might be helpful because the person I spoke of several days ago had a red truck at that time. His family also owns a business (The Railyard Racquet & Health Club) directly across from one of the gas stations I spoke of yesterday. Not pointing fingers though I am sure that LE is already following up on what I gave them.

You most certainly are pointing fingers. This is getting beyond ridiculous. Hey Anne and LG where are you now? Nothing to say while fingers are being pointed and someone's family is getting dragged thru the mud.
Bill you only know what you heard about this person, that is hearsay. You do not know without a doubt that this person is guilty of anything concerning MM.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what family owns that business and who you are talking about.
The police or CC are handling this now so dragging this person and his family through the mud will do no good whatsoever.
There's even a law against it. It's called libel.

RO's description of the truck and her experience that night: "I wish I could give an exact description of the truck but I can not. I was walking that night about 7 p.m to the local store. As I was walking up the hill, a truck passed me and slowed down. When it got to the middle of the hill it stopped in the road. I immediately looked at the plate and noticed it was from Massachusetts. There is only 1 street light there and I could not tell how many people were in the vehicle. As I got closer to the truck it took off up the hill. When I rounded the corner to the store, I could see the truck in the driveway of the store. As I walked into the parking lot, which is well lit, the truck took off toward the crash site,(of course at that time I did not know there was a crash). As for the red truck, it slowed, then stopped and waited for me to get closer, then took off up the hill. He did not leave the store parking lot in any sort of hurry. When I entered the store I asked if she saw the people in that truck and she said no, no one had come in. I told her about them stopping in the hill. Then we just forgot about it. I stood in the store a while and was there when the police and ambulance went by. I never saw that truck again. The only way I can describe it is that it looked like someone who delivered wood. That was my first thought about it........red, MA plates and delivered wood. Either having a wood body or even just slats in the body. It was not a king cab or extra cab. Just a regular truck. That is all I can tell you. I was in the Swiftwater store for 1/2 hour - 45 minutes. It was about 20-30 minutes after I was there that the police went by. I am not at all Maura's size and in fact I was bundled up that night. I believe I caught the truck off guard as I was walking well off the road and as they passed I walked back on, which is why I believe they stopped completely. They could not see me without any street lights and maybe went to the store and waited for me to get up there to get a better look??? I don't know. That is just how it seemed to me. The truck didn't scare me. My thought is that they/he/she thought I was someone else. That is what I was thinking that night. When I saw them sitting at the store, I again thought, they really think I am someone else. And as I got closer and I could see the driver moving around - I was thinking, there, I am not the person you are looking for, and he drove off. I wish to God I could remember what I was wearing that night, but I can't. Someone asked about the truck and whether it was 4 wheel drive. I believe it was. I have been looking at trucks and have determined that it was definitely a four wheel drive or at least it was a 3/4 ton pick up, because it sat up high. The other thing I remember is that the window in the back was hard to see in....it wasn't very large.....which tells me it was an older truck maybe???"

(The above is copy/paste)..only to note "times"

RO "lived" (past tense) on a side street Bxxxa Rd.