Maura Murray

rozShoem wrote:

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I believe you'd mentioned you had directed, lead one of the searches for Maura. Your description of a person as "every drunk that runs from a car crash" provides great insight as to why Maura has never been found. Let's hope that others in the search did not share your attitude. Policy SHOULD change regarding resources for local police departments. When an abandoned car is found it should be impounded, not hauled off to a local garage somewhere. When it is specifically NOT known what happened to the vehicle's driver....the car should not simply be hauled off to a local garage somewhere. You talk about the expenditure of money. Possibly had enough funding (manpower and other resources) been available within the first several hours of Maura's accident, funding for searching for her over the last 6 years might have been unnecessary. She might not have ever been found, but there may have at least been a few more clues, leads than what investigators have. Your words, "every drunk" says it all. If you see the drivers of abandoned vehicles as drunks....if you automatically assume they are all drunks, then we have a sad situation. You may be able to laugh, but quite frankly I find nothing to laugh about if this is your belief and as you say...you actually lead searches looking for the missing.

First, I have never said that I have ever had anything to do with any of the searches for Maura. And I have stated explicitly that I would have nothing to do with any future searches having to do with her under any condition entirely due to the some of the personalities involved and specifically due to one person in particular.

It is difficult to have a conversation with you on this subject because you have no grasp of the fundamental issues involved with search and rescue. You seem to enjoy taking things out of context.

Her crash is not the first time that I and other public safety professionals have come across a vehicle that was abandoned with alcohol involved. Anybody involved in these type of searches, rescues or EMS, police or fire all know the symptoms and have seen it hundreds of times and know full well what is happening.

Also, there is no correlation between the description of drunks running from car accidents, and the way I conduct searches or EMS calls as you seem to want to imply. I know it's fun for you to assume that I'm not professional because of the statements I make on this forum. But the fact remains when I'm involved in a case I am as professional as anybody else. The fact that I have enough experience that I can do good scene size ups based upon the information I see at the scene of a crash is considered to be a huge asset and is part of the reason that I'm considered very useful on scenes.

The most important concept that you miss is this. Lets assume that all the resources you want, air, land, sea, etc. arrive at the scene after Maura goes missing. Lets also spend every dime that you want, tens, even hundreds of thousands of dollars. Would it change the outcome? Because that is actually what we want is a better outcome. The answer is likely no. If you really believe that a persons life is priceless, you really don't have a clue. We make decisions on the value of a human life all the time. From the planes we build to the way we determine who gets what types of medical care and procedures.

Bill

Snowy wrote:

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or leave their cars overnight in the breakdown lane on highways.
who is looking out for you? really, only your loved ones...family and friends. there cannot be an expectation that authorities be able to protect us from our ourselves, or be ever-present to protect us from the actions of others.

Yep. If you saw the 20/20 episode about the Kim family. If you watched the whole episode, at the end they did a "lessons learned" segment. One of the lessons learned was to make sure you let someone know where you are going and the route of travel. What a surprise. the funniest part of this is when I have said that, over and over, I get mean faces and other terribly hurtful icons. I hope these same people make sure they give the 20/20 staff those same flames and mean faces. I am sure they will be as impressed as I am.

Bill

I watched the 20/20 "Wrong Turn" last night. I was
very impressed with the zeal of the search and
rescue.

Just as a general observation. Searches rarely occur on sunny days with the temps in the mid 60's so people who do SAR, as a general rule are highly motivated and very serious about their jobs. Those that aren't don't last. And bear in mind that most SAR teams in the US are not paid, they are exclusively volunteer. I have been involved with UVWRT, CCSAR, MRS, and AVSAR over the years with some searches and rescues. I teach SAR and other things in several fire departments and other organizations and have run more than one search for these organizations. I am familiar with and know people though I haven't worked with PVSAR and DAWGS, NEK9. All are volunteer organizations that rarely get a dime and generally speaking are very competent and train manically. You must to be competent. SAR skills are perishable.

Bill

Quackula wrote:

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You talk about the expenditure of money.

Yes I walk the talk and fear the fashion.

rozShoem wrote:

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...then you'd better assist your close friend "Bill" with editing his lengthy note. Good luck with that.

No need, his wasn't pointless.

Snowy wrote:

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or leave their cars overnight in the breakdown lane on highways.
who is looking out for you? really, only your loved ones...family and friends. there cannot be an expectation that authorities be able to protect us from our ourselves, or be ever-present to protect us from the actions of others.

at this point, i will comment, as Bill has before me, that the childish meanie faces, glowing flames and big red Xs are surprising to the extent that these little old ladies, and younger old ladies, must have an expectation that the police be all knowing, watchful over, and responsible for the comings and goings of our family members.
or that teachers can force students to learn.
or that the gov'mint will forever make provisions for our health and welfare.
actually, self-reliance is the reality.
and, guess what? no one else cares for, loves your family member, or will miss them more than you do.

Snowy wrote:

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at this point, i will comment, as Bill has before me, that the childish meanie faces, glowing flames and big red Xs are surprising to the extent that these little old ladies, and younger old ladies, must have an expectation that the police be all knowing, watchful over, and responsible for the comings and goings of our family members.
or that teachers can force students to learn.
or that the gov'mint will forever make provisions for our health and welfare.
actually, self-reliance is the reality.
and, guess what? no one else cares for, loves your family member, or will miss them more than you do.

That first part duuuuuude. I agree. We liberals don't want everyone in society to have a police escort them everywhere as a personal bodyguard.
But I'm all for helping others help themselves, and having other rich people pay for it. You know, like millionaires.

Hi Mr. meany faces. You have such anger issues. Why is your face yellow? Does your tounge get dry?

You know something don't you.

Its not my fault I was created this way. Go do some Kernel work or hang out at the historical society with the old folks. Have fun spinning the microfilm reels.

How do youu like my glasses?

question: which fact or significant piece of information has been established or revealed over the past 2-3 years.

answer: not one

Snowy wrote:

question: which fact or significant piece of information has been established or revealed over the past 2-3 years.
answer: not one

What would posters like to see answered here in this Topix thread? Not a final answer, such as where is Maura or, if she was murdered, who did it. But a kind of step in the right direction, just a small but new and helpful fact - unambiguous fact - that would move things forward, if by no means other than simple elimination? A good clue. Just one thing that might not solve the case but lead in the right direction?

What kind of intermediate fact would be most helpful?

In, in broader terms, what way can this thread help determine what happened to Maura Murray? How can it assist LE or how can it motivate someone to recall something they never thought worthwhile?

So, what kinds of stepping-stone facts would people like to see, and how can this thread help determine what happened to Maura Murray?

Another question. Does anyone think that someone from Maura's immediate family should publically support or endorse the continuation of online discussions of Maura's disappearance? Or should they, in some kind of simple statement, distance themselves from the old MMM forum and/or these Topix threads?

Their continued silence all these years seems like tacit approval of online discussions.

Maura's family always has the opportunity to ask that these discussions cease.

Detective Columbo,

Why don't you just man up and tell me/us what your point is? What are you getting at with all your posts, etc? Tell me privately if you want. Why all the get up? Why not just say it straight out?

Can't you at least, a good part of the time, behave like a normal poster? More like WTF/Bill or Snowy or sarah or hannah_b or L4M or posters like them who are clear?

Sometimes it's okay to be off-beat, humorous, off topic, dramatic, whatever, or to dangle something out there in hopes of getting a valuable response, but not constantly, not all the time.

Why do you have to present yourself so mysteriously all the time?

Go ahead, send me an email and write it like a normal person. No links to pointless sites or anything like that. Just normal talk. Okay?

Beagle wrote:

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What would posters like to see answered here in this Topix thread? Not a final answer, such as where is Maura or, if she was murdered, who did it. But a kind of step in the right direction, just a small but new and helpful fact - unambiguous fact - that would move things forward, if by no means other than simple elimination? A good clue. Just one thing that might not solve the case but lead in the right direction?
What kind of intermediate fact would be most helpful?
In, in broader terms, what way can this thread help determine what happened to Maura Murray? How can it assist LE or how can it motivate someone to recall something they never thought worthwhile?
So, what kinds of stepping-stone facts would people like to see, and how can this thread help determine what happened to Maura Murray?

thoughtfully and politely stated. good questions.

Snowy wrote:

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thoughtfully and politely stated. good questions.

Agreed.

Bill

Beagle wrote:

Detective Columbo,
Why don't you just man up and tell me/us what your point is? What are you getting at with all your posts, etc? Tell me privately if you want. Why all the get up? Why not just say it straight out?
Can't you at least, a good part of the time, behave like a normal poster? More like WTF/Bill or Snowy or sarah or hannah_b or L4M or posters like them who are clear?
Sometimes it's okay to be off-beat, humorous, off topic, dramatic, whatever, or to dangle something out there in hopes of getting a valuable response, but not constantly, not all the time.
Why do you have to present yourself so mysteriously all the time?
Go ahead, send me an email and write it like a normal person. No links to pointless sites or anything like that. Just normal talk. Okay?

As this question is not for me to answer, I'll respond to the question you never asked.
Take a good look at the feedback you received from Snowy and WTH. That is but once set of response type you should have received, and deserved from the beginning. Know it.

Mr Coke Bottles wrote:

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As this question is not for me to answer, I'll respond to the question you never asked.
Take a good look at the feedback you received from Snowy and WTH. That is but once set of response type you should have received, and deserved from the beginning. Know it.

Beagle ~ don't presume any / all of the anonymous posters to be Columbo. there are some rational AND compassionate folks on this forum. let's keep your questions in mind going forward and use them to guide us in the right direction....toward any viable piece of information.

Snowy wrote:

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Beagle ~ don't presume any / all of the anonymous posters to be Columbo. there are some rational AND compassionate folks on this forum. let's keep your questions in mind going forward and use them to guide us in the right direction....toward any viable piece of information.

Maybe you haven't seen the kinds of emails he sends out. I somehow don't think the HGH from Canada was what he was getting at. Best regards to Svennie, BTW.