Maura Murray

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
well said.
your experience predates my mind, but others have witnessed and testified to this method of managing the "finding" of Maura Murray.
cult is the operative word.
it is the mystery overshadowing the mystery.
the newer people may not understand how this history has shaped the conversation for over 10 years.
it is bizarre.

"cult" What qualifications do you and Hannah have to make such a statement? Is this in the field of your expertise that you work at or merely just your opinion?

BillNH wrote:

<quoted text>
Recent events in Boston is a perfect example of what giving the public the right information can do.
I also have never seen any indication on the part of any LE organization that they were ever given the information being discussed here today. I do recall seeing written proof of NHSP being frustrated by Fred's insistence that nothing prior to NH matters and in turn seeing Fred criticize NHLE for hanging onto the suicide theory despite it being the first thing out of Fred's mouth. Our morbid curiosity is on par with all LE involved. If you can show me where LE stated that they ever felt MM's family was freely forthcoming with information I and everyone else would be happy to see it.

You do realize that the FBI conducted the investigation in mass correct? They interviewed her friends and family and asked all of the questions that people are asking today, do you really think they didn't know what gallery she worked at and which friends were at the party, etc?
So the FBI did the mass end of the investigation and found nothing that indicated a connection between what was happening in mass and her dissapearance.

It's just ridiculous that people online now think they can solve the case if only they had this background info, the same background info that the FBI had 9 years ago.

I can see where you're coming from but just ask yourself honestly, do you really think that anyone on here, or even renner, is going to solve this case if you have more background info? Do you really think that 9 years later you're going to come up with a break in the case that the FBI couldn't when the case was fresh?

How about the gallery into as an example- now people know the name of the gallery, well ok but what is anyone going to do with that that's going to bring a resolution to the case that the FBI couldn't when the case was fresh? Can you give me an example of how this helps further ANYTHING except satisfy people's curiosity?

Why does it seem that the same people that are CONSTANTLY making fun of people for thinking they're going to solve the case online, people who've NEVER even said that, are the ones that are talking like if only they could have all the info about her life in Amherst this case would be solved? See what I'm saying? it's total hypocrisy.

Besides having the rudest, nastiest, most argumentative posters i've ever seen on ANY internet form EVER, also has some of the biggest hypocrites i've ever witnessed anywhere, and that's a FACT.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>"cult" What qualifications do you and Hannah have to make such a statement? Is this in the field of your expertise that you work at or merely just your opinion?

Does studies in the history of religions and having been raised in a clerical environment count as qualifying? Some aspects of how the case has been handled by people close to the case and family is clearly cult like in the refusal to discuss other than the approved aspects, ostracizing those questioning the approved atandpoint. Google cult criteria, it fits so well with what went on on the early forums it´s scary. Unfortunately little seems to have changed. Julie M´s letter recently published on Renner´s blog is indicative of the same mentality.

BillNH wrote:

<quoted text>
Recent events in Boston is a perfect example of what giving the public the right information can do.
I also have never seen any indication on the part of any LE organization that they were ever given the information being discussed here today. I do recall seeing written proof of NHSP being frustrated by Fred's insistence that nothing prior to NH matters and in turn seeing Fred criticize NHLE for hanging onto the suicide theory despite it being the first thing out of Fred's mouth. Our morbid curiosity is on par with all LE involved. If you can show me where LE stated that they ever felt MM's family was freely forthcoming with information I and everyone else would be happy to see it.

You are talking about 2 different cases and 2 totally diferent situations. You cannot compare the 2. Sadly to say lives have been lost and forever lives have been changed concerning Boston. The circumstances are not the same. Mauras case is an on going investigation regardless of what you see written on a forum LE cannot discuss it.It was LE that came up with the suicide theory not Fred.

BSG knew the Saturn had sustained body damage to the hood area before it left Amherst. Who else knew?

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>You are talking about 2 different cases and 2 totally diferent situations. You cannot compare the 2. Sadly to say lives have been lost and forever lives have been changed concerning Boston. The circumstances are not the same. Mauras case is an on going investigation regardless of what you see written on a forum LE cannot discuss it.It was LE that came up with the suicide theory not Fred.

I'm sorry, but that last sentence makes no sense whatsoever.

LE did not know maura murray from a pink cobra, they would not be in the business of making up theories without first hearing from family.

No investigation would be underway in fact, until they had made contact with maura's family.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Does studies in the history of religions and having been raised in a clerical environment count as qualifying? Some aspects of how the case has been handled by people close to the case and family is clearly cult like in the refusal to discuss other than the approved aspects, ostracizing those questioning the approved atandpoint. Google cult criteria, it fits so well with what went on on the early forums it´s scary. Unfortunately little seems to have changed. Julie M´s letter recently published on Renner´s blog is indicative of the same mentality.

I have done alot of searching. Does it qualify me as a searcher? No. I have done alot of interveiwing. Does it qualify me to be an investigator? No.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>I have done alot of searching. Does it qualify me as a searcher? No. I have done alot of interveiwing. Does it qualify me to be an investigator? No.

The study of cults and cult like environments is part of these studies at one of the most respected universities in Europe. I also studied some psychology. One of my professors is one of the leading experts in Europe on the subjects of cults. I am at least somewhat qualified to have an opinion. Expert, no. Educated, yes.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>I have done alot of searching. Does it qualify me as a searcher? No. I have done alot of interveiwing. Does it qualify me to be an investigator? No.

I suggest you search some more. Maybe you´ll learn something.

BillNH- Did you really just compare the events in Boston to this case?? You can't be serious can you?

LE didn't release everything about these kids, they didn't even release their names, let alone backgroud info on them, all they released was their PICTURES so IDK how your comparison even makes the slightest bit of sense in that regard.

But besides that little fact it wasn't like their pictures being released even is what got them caught, nobody called in tips saying they knew them, In fact one girl that as a friend of the younger kid thought she recogized them but DIDN'T call in because she didn't think it was possible that he could've done the crime.

So it wasn't LE releasing every single thing they knew about these kids that got them caught at all, it was their own stupidity.
As soon as these kids saw their faces plastered on TV they obviously bugged out and ended up getting themselves caught. THey murdered a MIT campus cop and then they car-jacked somebody, driving them around a little while and apparently telling them they were the boston bombers. THey let that guy go and he called the cops, gave his car description and that was what led to the car chase throgh the streets of Boston that ended in the shootout in Watertown that left the older kid dead.

So no, it had nothing to do with LE releasing any info about these kids that got them caught, they hadn't eeven released anything except their pictures at that point.

So you're comparison to the two cases makes absolutely no sense at all even with the furthest stretch of the imagination.

I don't want to derail this thread with the boston bombing but the cops actually did a pretty piss-poor job at finding the younger kid. They literally locked down a 20 block setion of watertown going house to house and searching every home there, I know 2 people who had their homes searched by cops. They locked down 20 blocks and searched EVERY home and the kid was hiding 1/4 mile away in a boat in someone's back yard??? Are they for real??? They search people's home's before their back yards? That's just bad, horrible police work right there. The kid was hiding in a boat that had a ripped tarp and blood stains around it. THat's just a bad search all the way around, what happened to 'they searched every nook and cranny'' ridiculous, and they're being hailed as heroes like they did the best job ever. If those kids weren't IDIOTS they probably never would've been caught.
EIther way- THem finding those kids had nothing to do with releasing any info, not at all.

I don't see how you could've possibly even thought there was any comparison to this case.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>do you think its a possibility or do you know this as a fact. Im asking for a specific reason which I will not post.

Fact if my research and source is correct. Interesting is that you did not need a major cc to rent, would run drivers license though.

IMO, a relative looks like Maura.

Jenkins wrote:

.... LE didn't release everything about these kids.... In fact one girl that as a friend of the younger kid ....
As soon as these kids saw their faces plastered on TV .... the shootout in Watertown that left the older kid dead.... any info about these kids that got them caught....did a pretty piss-poor job at finding the younger kid....and the kid was hiding 1/4 mile away in a boat in someone's back yard.... The kid was hiding in a boat ....If those kids weren't IDIOTS .... THem finding those kids had nothing to do with....

Are you aware that one of these men was 26 YEARS OLD, MARRIED AND A FATHER??? And the younger one was 19, arguably a "kid" but the press refers to him as a "man". At what age do people stop being "kids" and "young girls" and what not to you, J?

.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Snowy, your observations are fair and accurate, and I agree to the fullest extent. As to what is/has been driving the MM missing machine (very accurate choice of words!) I really don´t know. It has been clear from the very beginning being a believer in the Murray cult and not questioning what the leadership deems right, is way more important than finding MM. I say somebody has something to hide, something that is not just embarassing, but truly damaging to those concerned. There have been so many missing cases where family has not feared stating in media or online forums their missing loved one was a drug addict or a prostitute, but we love her, please help find her. I´m not suggesting MM was a drug addict or a prostitute, just making a comparison between families behavior.

Please....you are wasting your time and intelligence on something that only exists in your mind. There is no cult, no hidden agenda, no MM missing machine.

mcsmom wrote:

<quoted text>
Please....you are wasting your time and intelligence on something that only exists in your mind. There is no cult, no hidden agenda, no MM missing machine.

Noone suggested there being an actual cult. Just discussing peoples behavior on a now defunct forum. Having some insight into this is vital to understanding current discussions on the topic of MM. A metadiscourse if you like, discussing the discussion.

Advocate wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you aware that one of these men was 26 YEARS OLD, MARRIED AND A FATHER??? And the younger one was 19, arguably a "kid" but the press refers to him as a "man". At what age do people stop being "kids" and "young girls" and what not to you, J?
.

I know an 80 year old who refers to 55 year olds as kids and young boys/girls.

Jenkins wrote:

BillNH- Did you really just compare the events in Boston to this case?? You can't be serious can you?
LE didn't release everything about these kids, they didn't even release their names, let alone backgroud info on them, all they released was their PICTURES so IDK how your comparison even makes the slightest bit of sense in that regard.
But besides that little fact it wasn't like their pictures being released even is what got them caught, nobody called in tips saying they knew them, In fact one girl that as a friend of the younger kid thought she recogized them but DIDN'T call in because she didn't think it was possible that he could've done the crime.
So it wasn't LE releasing every single thing they knew about these kids that got them caught at all, it was their own stupidity.
As soon as these kids saw their faces plastered on TV they obviously bugged out and ended up getting themselves caught. THey murdered a MIT campus cop and then they car-jacked somebody, driving them around a little while and apparently telling them they were the boston bombers. THey let that guy go and he called the cops, gave his car description and that was what led to the car chase throgh the streets of Boston that ended in the shootout in Watertown that left the older kid dead.
So no, it had nothing to do with LE releasing any info about these kids that got them caught, they hadn't eeven released anything except their pictures at that point.
So you're comparison to the two cases makes absolutely no sense at all even with the furthest stretch of the imagination.
I don't want to derail this thread with the boston bombing but the cops actually did a pretty piss-poor job at finding the younger kid. They literally locked down a 20 block setion of watertown going house to house and searching every home there, I know 2 people who had their homes searched by cops. They locked down 20 blocks and searched EVERY home and the kid was hiding 1/4 mile away in a boat in someone's back yard??? Are they for real??? They search people's home's before their back yards? That's just bad, horrible police work right there. The kid was hiding in a boat that had a ripped tarp and blood stains around it. THat's just a bad search all the way around, what happened to 'they searched every nook and cranny'' ridiculous, and they're being hailed as heroes like they did the best job ever. If those kids weren't IDIOTS they probably never would've been caught.
EIther way- THem finding those kids had nothing to do with releasing any info, not at all.
I don't see how you could've possibly even thought there was any comparison to this case.

There is no comparison between the 2 cases. But living 10 minutes away from the bombing I have to commend everyone for all they have done. Watertown as well as surrounding towns were on lock down. All MBTA services were closed down through out the whole state. They searched homes in Watertown to make sure no one was being held hostage. There number one priority at that point was public safety.

BillNH wrote:

<quoted text>
Recent events in Boston is a perfect example of what giving the public the right information can do.
I also have never seen any indication on the part of any LE organization that they were ever given the information being discussed here today. I do recall seeing written proof of NHSP being frustrated by Fred's insistence that nothing prior to NH matters and in turn seeing Fred criticize NHLE for hanging onto the suicide theory despite it being the first thing out of Fred's mouth. Our morbid curiosity is on par with all LE involved. If you can show me where LE stated that they ever felt MM's family was freely forthcoming with information I and everyone else would be happy to see it.

Do you honestly think that social media had nothing to do with these terrorists being caught so fast? The fact that their pictures were out and everyone with any form of digital communication was immediately part of the investigation was THE reason they had to run. That is my point. If the family was willing to include other in what they new, this could have turned out much differently.

As for the actual capture, the news I watched the younger brother hid in the boat after the property was searched and it was the owner walking his dog that noticed the blood and the broken strap on the boat. Again, an informed public is a valuable tool.

I am not implying that 9 years after the fact that the name of the art gallery is going to crack the case but some accurate information 9 years ago may have had a much greater impact.

Advocate- I'm 33 years old and me and my friends still call people our age kids. Not as in children, but it's a term young people use nowadays.

I don't see how that offends you in any way, what do you care?

Calling those guys kids doesn't mean that they're children, that's not what I was saying at all, but who gives a shit if I was calling them kids?? Obviously not an accurate description but it wasn't meant to be. On those guys you probably have a point but seriously who gives a shit?

As for calling Maura a girl, that is a perfectly accurate description, even to call her a young girl is still accurate. She's a girl and she's not old, young girl is perfectly fine for describing a 21yr old girl. Young woman is more accurate but I don't talk like that, I write how I speak and I don't call anyone a young woman. Nowadays girls are still girls all through their 20's, that's just the way young people speak, sorry to tell you.

I know people around here like to be the grammar police but that's pretty much the stupidest form of post there is, seriously who gives a shit? I don't.

Bottom line is Maura can be described as a young girl or a young woman or a girl, I certainly wouldn't call her a woman, that's like a lady in her 40's or some shit.

And again, what the hell do you care?? Did you really feel the need to waste your time with that stupid post?

What happened to you advocate? Who exactly are you an advocate for murders and rapists and women beaters? Maybe you should spend a little more time defending Alden for making those videos taunting Maura's family? What was it? We don't understand what he meant by them? Or was it we don't get his humor?

Jenkins wrote:

Advocate- I'm 33 years old and me and my friends still call people our age kids. Not as in children, but it's a term young people use nowadays.
I don't see how that offends you in any way, what do you care?
Calling those guys kids doesn't mean that they're children, that's not what I was saying at all, but who gives a shit if I was calling them kids?? Obviously not an accurate description but it wasn't meant to be. On those guys you probably have a point but seriously who gives a shit?
As for calling Maura a girl, that is a perfectly accurate description, even to call her a young girl is still accurate. She's a girl and she's not old, young girl is perfectly fine for describing a 21yr old girl. Young woman is more accurate but I don't talk like that, I write how I speak and I don't call anyone a young woman. Nowadays girls are still girls all through their 20's, that's just the way young people speak, sorry to tell you.
I know people around here like to be the grammar police but that's pretty much the stupidest form of post there is, seriously who gives a shit? I don't.
Bottom line is Maura can be described as a young girl or a young woman or a girl, I certainly wouldn't call her a woman, that's like a lady in her 40's or some shit.
And again, what the hell do you care?? Did you really feel the need to waste your time with that stupid post?
What happened to you advocate? Who exactly are you an advocate for murders and rapists and women beaters? Maybe you should spend a little more time defending Alden for making those videos taunting Maura's family? What was it? We don't understand what he meant by them? Or was it we don't get his humor?

I wouldnt worry about this Jenkins. Its only a figure of speech. My adult child I always refer to them as my kid or my oldest child.

BillNH wrote:

<quoted text>As for the actual capture, the news I watched the younger brother hid in the boat after the property was searched and it was the owner walking his dog that noticed the blood and the broken strap on the boat. Again, an informed public is a valuable tool.

The property where Dzhokhar Tsarnaev (DT) was captured was just outside of the perimeter of the search area and had not been searched.

I was glued to the case from the news conference at 5:20 on Thursday until Tsarnaev was captured Friday night - I didn't sleep. I absolutely agree that social media helped tremendously in the capture. The photos and video the FBI released were helpful, but it was the high-resolution photograph taken by a bystander at the Marathon that clearly identified DT's face. That photo was published simultaneously with it's submittal to the FBI on Reddit, and quickly re-posted on other social media as well as news sources. That photo, probably more than the FBI footage, would have been enough to make the Tsarnaev brothers run.

Unfortunately, prior to that clear photo being published, I watched as Reddit and other blogs exploded with the info that DT's photos looked very like the missing Brown University student, Sunil Tripathi. Input his name on Google Image Search - you will see the FBI video photos of DT and Tripathi put together. Although I too saw a large resemblance between the two, it wasn't strong enough for me to say it was him. But the public had him tried and convicted even after the high-res photo appeared. I truly believe that it was social media revealing his name that led to his name and another man's name being transmitted on the Boston PD's scanner. Prior to the ID of the Tsarnaev's as the suspects, most of the online community was tracking down info on Tripathi and posting anything they could find.

So, as much as social media helped in the Boston case, it also led to police searching for the wrong person(s) and could have easily led to a bad end for the wrongly-named people.

Now back to our local Maura Murray programming