Maura Murray

Melting Snow wrote:

<quoted text>
Snowy, snow that has been around for too long eventually melts and evaporates. A fact of nature.
You suddenly turned nasty on Kitten just because she overshadowed you on some bank teller issue nonsense. Your petty jealousy and bitterness drove her off this forum. Now you are trying to regain some credibility by tromping down the middle road trying to attract people from both sides. Your jealousy and pettiness was all to evident. Pathetic. And so very, very, very childish.

well, my immediate recollection is that she decided to personalize the issue about the teller post., and added unwarranted name-calling.. that's petty and poor form.
just before that, she decided to strike out a citigirl, rather harshly, for less than perfect grammar/usage. also, poor form.
further, Kitten was thoroughly enjoying a cat-fest with SB. both of them can hold their own.
think what you will....not interested in a popularity contest, and you're welcome to your opinion.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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There's certainly an abundance of them especially now that the apples are falling off the trees.
It might also explain the prints seen in one of the yards. There are always tracks there in the winter.

Hey those same footprints go right through my yard and onto my deck. Maybe Maura's just renting from me all this time?

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
well, my immediate recollection is that she decided to personalize the issue about the teller post., and added unwarranted name-calling.. that's petty and poor form.
just before that, she decided to strike out a citigirl, rather harshly, for less than perfect grammar/usage. also, poor form.
further, Kitten was thoroughly enjoying a cat-fest with SB. both of them can hold their own.
think what you will....not interested in a popularity contest, and you're welcome to your opinion.

you personalized it snowy, when you accused her of planting evidence. and the remark to citigirl was clearly teasing. i joined her facebook group. she was nice, which is less than i can say about you.

factual recollection wrote:

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you personalized it snowy, when you accused her of planting evidence. and the remark to citigirl was clearly teasing. i joined her facebook group. she was nice, which is less than i can say about you.

i stand completely behind my posts.

kitten wrote:

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Just me, I am here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/shesnotthere/
The only people who get deleted here are the mean ones.:)

Thanks, I just send an "add me" to you. Might take awhile to catch up,
Linda

watching paint dry

WTH-the-original wrote:

I just kind of figured people finally got tired of the pointless windmilling?
Nothing useful happening here, move along....
In memory of SBD
Bill

time to evoke the #23 post on this thread. take a look back. it will never change. enjoy your day; i will.

Snowy wrote:

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never.
and whether the glove was worn and scented or never worn. and why her room was packed, and why she brought her textbooks along in the car.
so many years, so few facts, and worse, so much misinformation.
i think it must be difficult to have a stranger prying into details that Helena and family may already know, but perhaps have chosen to withhold. in the end, if Renner's book is published, it is not certain anyone will be closer to knowing what happened to Maura; that is, assuming LE knows what Maura's family knows and what Renner intends to find out.
i'd think the Murray family would be willing to authorize / write their own FACTUAL account about her disappearance, if they feel the timing is right, and if they want to set the record straight. otherwise, all of this windmilling (quoting WTH/Bill) on forums has been a useless exercise.
that SOCO / SOHO? piece was inconsistent with some of the information that's been discussed and written about over the years.
what's next?

Snowy there are to many unkowns in this case.

Snowy wrote:

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well, citigirl, i still believe this subject on topix is still alive precisely because these big kids love to play with the topix judging buttons. you can just imagine...working those buttons.

Look at how people have judged me on my postings.Im not to popular here according to the judging. But I just laugh it off and go on to the next posting.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Look at how people have judged me on my postings.Im not to popular here according to the judging. But I just laugh it off and go on to the next posting.

there has been a surge of "judging", for and against, over the past few days.
someone has been enjoying a judging party; banging out and manipulating little icons to override any opinion except their own. there is an obvious need to be right. silliness.:)

factual recollection wrote:

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you personalized it snowy, when you accused her of planting evidence. and the remark to citigirl was clearly teasing. i joined her facebook group. she was nice, which is less than i can say about you.

I have a sense of humor but Kittens first posting was to attack. Look at Kittens first posting on page 241 and continue on reading Kittens postings. Kitten told me I should be ashamed of what Iam posting on the internet because it is an on going investigation. But yet Kitten stands behind Renner whom is posting on the internet?

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Snowy there are to many unkowns in this case.

i hadn't really thought about the dilemma that Helena may be facing regarding Renner's appearance until yesterday; i had to wonder why someone was fighting so hard for his acceptance.
i've had a few honest exchanges with Helena, and will say she is not the object of my personal dislike; others feel differently about what they perceive to be her limiting and/or manipulating the release of information to the public.
i do, however, feel very strongly about the presence of a certain group of posters, united over the years, who has intentionally mislead the public when certain subjects were raised about Maura. all the while they begged to "find Maura" and keep the forums alive while sending people in e-circles and on wild goose chases (hence...red herrings).
while it is outwardly suspicious that a family would choose to hide more than they reveal about a missing loved one, in the end it may not be right for anyone to judge them.
that said, it seems like what Helena has been doing over the years isn't working. if Renner is an unwelcome presence, for whatever reason, then they might consider cooperating with him or totally shutting him out.
the truth likely falls somewhere in the middle of what is known and what is unknown. i welcome honest, adult feedback to my impressions. they may or may not be accurate, or even worthy of comment.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>I have a sense of humor but Kittens first posting was to attack. Look at Kittens first posting on page 241 and continue on reading Kittens postings. Kitten told me I should be ashamed of what Iam posting on the internet because it is an on going investigation. But yet Kitten stands behind Renner whom is posting on the internet?

i have been obviously unhappy with her sudden appearance and her need to personally attacking several of us. SB and i will tangle from time to time about the subject, and it doesn't descend to a personal confrontation. i am committed to say what i mean, and mean what i say, and sometimes i change my mind. Kitten has an agenda; she has taken it from Amherst to Franconia, and back to her FB endeavor. i wish her good luck.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
There's certainly an abundance of them especially now that the apples are falling off the trees.
It might also explain the prints seen in one of the yards. There are always tracks there in the winter.

I've seen more black bear this year than ever in my life. Almost hit one 2 month's ago. I came around a curve doing about 25mph on a dark moonless night and a bear was right in my lane on a narrow two lane road and I slammed on the brakes. There was a guardrail and to my amazement the bear spun and dove UNDER the guardrail. I was amazed at how agile and fast the bear was. I almost got the impression the bear had done this before.
A week later I had one 10 feet from my kitchen door, I opened the door to go out and it was a full grown adult. The bear looked as shocked as I was lol. Don't know what he wanted as I had no bird feeders or food source out there, just passing through I guess.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
i hadn't really thought about the dilemma that Helena may be facing regarding Renner's appearance until yesterday; i had to wonder why someone was fighting so hard for his acceptance.
i've had a few honest exchanges with Helena, and will say she is not the object of my personal dislike; others feel differently about what they perceive to be her limiting and/or manipulating the release of information to the public.
i do, however, feel very strongly about the presence of a certain group of posters, united over the years, who has intentionally mislead the public when certain subjects were raised about Maura. all the while they begged to "find Maura" and keep the forums alive while sending people in e-circles and on wild goose chases (hence...red herrings).
while it is outwardly suspicious that a family would choose to hide more than they reveal about a missing loved one, in the end it may not be right for anyone to judge them.
that said, it seems like what Helena has been doing over the years isn't working. if Renner is an unwelcome presence, for whatever reason, then they might consider cooperating with him or totally shutting him out.
the truth likely falls somewhere in the middle of what is known and what is unknown. i welcome honest, adult feedback to my impressions. they may or may not be accurate, or even worthy of comment.

Snowy this is my own personal opinion. Its nothing to do with Renner personally. But our family has been searching to answers as well as searching for Maura since 2004. You have a book writer show up 7 to almost 8 years later after Maura disappeared saying they are going to search for Maura and find the answers. While we as a family have not found out where and what happened to Maura. Why is it that a writer of books thinks he can find out where and what happened to Maura? When we as a family dont even have the answers as to what happened to Maura. To be honest I have a problem with that. Family is not hiding anything. It is unknown to us as to why Maura left Amherst.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
i hadn't really thought about the dilemma that Helena may be facing regarding Renner's appearance until yesterday; i had to wonder why someone was fighting so hard for his acceptance.
i've had a few honest exchanges with Helena, and will say she is not the object of my personal dislike; others feel differently about what they perceive to be her limiting and/or manipulating the release of information to the public.
i do, however, feel very strongly about the presence of a certain group of posters, united over the years, who has intentionally mislead the public when certain subjects were raised about Maura. all the while they begged to "find Maura" and keep the forums alive while sending people in e-circles and on wild goose chases (hence...red herrings).
while it is outwardly suspicious that a family would choose to hide more than they reveal about a missing loved one, in the end it may not be right for anyone to judge them.
that said, it seems like what Helena has been doing over the years isn't working. if Renner is an unwelcome presence, for whatever reason, then they might consider cooperating with him or totally shutting him out.
the truth likely falls somewhere in the middle of what is known and what is unknown. i welcome honest, adult feedback to my impressions. they may or may not be accurate, or even worthy of comment.

While I hold no grudges toward Helena I do think that she could have prevented a lot of the hard feelings, bashing and name calling that went on in the first MMM forum that I believe she started and was moderator of.
When the bashing got way out of hand she would send the offender to a time out corner in a fantasy "time out tent". And when the bashing got real bad she would tell them that she liked her home and didn't want to lose it which tells me that she knew exactly how wrong it was. She chose to be a part of the bashing and encouraged it by not trying to stop it so it continued on.
While some that dared to stand up to the "group" and ones that didn't agree were removed from the forum, the biggest bashers of all were allowed to stay.
Get rid of all the locals and others that had some good ideas and keep a group of people that were only concerned with showing their hatred and bashing people to death. Not very smart if you ask me.
I cannot forget Helena's part in the MMM forum and the harm it caused.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
i hadn't really thought about the dilemma that Helena may be facing regarding Renner's appearance until yesterday; i had to wonder why someone was fighting so hard for his acceptance.
i've had a few honest exchanges with Helena, and will say she is not the object of my personal dislike; others feel differently about what they perceive to be her limiting and/or manipulating the release of information to the public.
I do, however, feel very strongly about the presence of a certain group of posters, united over the years, who has intentionally mislead the public when certain subjects were raised about Maura. all the while they begged to "find Maura" and keep the forums alive while sending people in e-circles and on wild goose chases (hence...red herrings).
while it is outwardly suspicious that a family would choose to hide more than they reveal about a missing loved one, in the end it may not be right for anyone to judge them.
that said, it seems like what Helena has been doing over the years isn't working. if Renner is an unwelcome presence, for whatever reason, then they might consider cooperating with him or totally shutting him out.
the truth likely falls somewhere in the middle of what is known and what is unknown. i welcome honest, adult feedback to my impressions. they may or may not be accurate, or even worthy of comment.

Sadly if friends and family were selective in what they revealed to authorities they could well have impeded the investigation. Perhaps they felt it had no relevance but they are not trained investigators and even they get it wrong. Sometimes the most innocuous detail turns out to be a case breaker.

I can't imagine what could be worth hiding verses finding a loved one in harms way. Though I have seen people so private they seem to fear anyone knowing anything about them or their family. I don't see Maura as some nutcase or monster I see her as one of many college students going through early adulthood making mistakes as many do and perhaps overreacting as some do.

I think the family wanted to portray Maura as the squeaky clean all American girl and perhaps they felt if any negative PR came out it would influence some not to work as hard toward finding her and impact public opinion. I see Maura as an overachiever, and when overachievers fail most fall HARD! She had problems at west point, she seemed to have relationship problems, she seemed to drink in excess, she wrecked Dads car and finally wrecked hers.

Sometimes we judge our selves the harshest, and perhaps that where Maura's state of mind was when she left Amherst Mass. I don't see suicide as her motive for leaving Amherst, trying to get her head straight perhaps. The final accident could have had a profound effect on her psyche. Initially I think she just wanted to distance herself from the scene, but after having time to reflect who knows what her state of mind was.

AS I previously stated, Butch Atwood said she was cold and shivering. If that was Maura seen miles down the road running she was in extreme danger of hypothermia. I have experienced hypothermia more than once and it can catch even trained and experienced hikers and survivalist off guard. Sometimes you have VERY limited time to react properly and that's if your equipped and knowledgeable.

I am leary of Renner, especially the whole bank account story. He is writing a book and many authors take liberty with so called facts and unnamed sources. Profit and ego can be ugly, sometimes the truth or lack of details isn't as interesting as embellishment, and as I previously stated dull, boring books don't sell, soap operas do.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
While I hold no grudges toward Helena I do think that she could have prevented a lot of the hard feelings, bashing and name calling that went on in the first MMM forum that I believe she started and was moderator of.
When the bashing got way out of hand she would send the offender to a time out corner in a fantasy "time out tent". And when the bashing got real bad she would tell them that she liked her home and didn't want to lose it which tells me that she knew exactly how wrong it was. She chose to be a part of the bashing and encouraged it by not trying to stop it so it continued on.
While some that dared to stand up to the "group" and ones that didn't agree were removed from the forum, the biggest bashers of all were allowed to stay.
Get rid of all the locals and others that had some good ideas and keep a group of people that were only concerned with showing their hatred and bashing people to death. Not very smart if you ask me.
I cannot forget Helena's part in the MMM forum and the harm it caused.

Helena was the enabler.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
While I hold no grudges toward Helena I do think that she could have prevented a lot of the hard feelings, bashing and name calling that went on in the first MMM forum that I believe she started and was moderator of.
When the bashing got way out of hand she would send the offender to a time out corner in a fantasy "time out tent". And when the bashing got real bad she would tell them that she liked her home and didn't want to lose it which tells me that she knew exactly how wrong it was. She chose to be a part of the bashing and encouraged it by not trying to stop it so it continued on.
While some that dared to stand up to the "group" and ones that didn't agree were removed from the forum, the biggest bashers of all were allowed to stay.
Get rid of all the locals and others that had some good ideas and keep a group of people that were only concerned with showing their hatred and bashing people to death. Not very smart if you ask me.
I cannot forget Helena's part in the MMM forum and the harm it caused.

All that hatred, garbage and libel that Helena allowed, other monitors delete and then ban the poster.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Snowy this is my own personal opinion. Its nothing to do with Renner personally. But our family has been searching to answers as well as searching for Maura since 2004. You have a book writer show up 7 to almost 8 years later after Maura disappeared saying they are going to search for Maura and find the answers. While we as a family have not found out where and what happened to Maura. Why is it that a writer of books thinks he can find out where and what happened to Maura? When we as a family dont even have the answers as to what happened to Maura. To be honest I have a problem with that. Family is not hiding anything. It is unknown to us as to why Maura left Amherst.

i understand what you are saying.
i'd guess many books are written about individuals and families without their cooperation and input. the McGinniss/Sarah Palin caper is a recent example.
there is no end chapter in sight for your family, so far, so it probably seems premature for a book to be written. the folks on these forums are interested in anyone being able to uncover more information, and to fact-find....but, of course, the 'public' has less to lose than the immediate family in terms of its being an intrusion into privacy.
if he is covering territory that is already familiar to the family, then it is doubtful his "search" will find Maura.