Maura Murray

Also, about that ATM picture(s)/video.....
What if it was not her taking out the money? Why not appeal to the public to help identify the person? Because this happened in MA, can't the police there show the picture to a family member? I realize they gave the case to NH, but certainly they must have a copy, just as they do have a copy of the hard drive. So frustrating!

My dad was a drinker and when he did come around, he could turn on me fast. I was his favorite, but he did hit me a few times while drinking, for things he swore he'd have spanked me for if I were younger. He always thought he was justified since Mom was raising us alone and having troubles at times.
Mom would give him the boot as she didn't believe in hitting or spanking. Especially by a man who was an angry drinker.(can't bring myself to call him a drunk) because he passed away in 88, in my arms.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
while the points you mention exist separately, i'm not certain they can be drawn together to arrive at the conclusion you make to explain why the videos haven't been released.
if traumatized by being "slapped around", and fleeing to the north under those circumstances, it is doubtful the priority would be to hide/cover one's face. after all, who would be looking, once she left the campus environment?
anything is possible, however. and mention of a physical confrontation is never too far away from our thoughts.

I´m not saying this is the concusion I draw or that this is my theory. Just that it is an interesting thought and fully plausible, and I wanted to just put it out there for people to consider. I too am doubtful hiding her face would have been a priority when leaving.

kitten wrote:

<quoted text>
That said, Fred's not known for restraining his temper. I'd be disappointed (but not surprised) if he had hit her after the first accident. It wouldn't take much to see she'd been drinking-- Skyy Blue mixed with wine is certainly stronger than a beer...

a haunting recollection is a theory put forth by Mason/Fred Leatherman, a former practicing criminal/defense attorney with 30 years experience, which he advanced some time ago about Maura's disappearance and the relationship with her father.
as an overview, Mason was especially critical of Fred Murray's behavior; this via the evidence he was able to gather from extensive reading and participation in forums about MM.
it was and is a controversial theory, with pieces of his thoughts still lingering here today.
i am sorry not to have links to this history.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
I´m not saying this is the concusion I draw or that this is my theory. Just that it is an interesting thought and fully plausible, and I wanted to just put it out there for people to consider. I too am doubtful hiding her face would have been a priority when leaving.

i cannot dispute your line of thinking, because anything is certainly possible...but i cannot personally connect the dots from injuries sustained by M in a confrontation to LE's withholding videos to hide evidence of her possible injuries. i don't know why they've been withholding videos, if, in fact, they exist.

FrmLE wrote:

This nonsense bickering has become ridiculous, no one even understands who is who except the small handful of people engaged in the incestuous sniping.
Blah

bite me

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
i cannot dispute your line of thinking, because anything is certainly possible...but i cannot personally connect the dots from injuries sustained by M in a confrontation to LE's withholding videos to hide evidence of her possible injuries. i don't know why they've been withholding videos, if, in fact, they exist.

LE in this case as well as others seems to have a policy of not releasing anything they deem evidence regardless of how innocuous it is. While it doesn't seem to make sense they see it differently.

PI Healy described Fred as " Volatile " according to an interview with Renner. I can't say he hit Maura, but I can sure see one heck of an A$$ chewing. Considering Maura's already seemingly fragile state that may have been the final straw for her to take a hiatus north. As far as her hair being down, I don't read into that very much, I wonder if the airbag or contact the windshield blew the bun?

Like I said before being described as an overachiever these people tend to fall hard and she let her dad as well as herself down. We also are not truly sure what set of the crying episode or episodes. Also people who have issues with alcohol tend to fall back on it as a crutch during hard emotional times, who knows what Maura's condition was after the crash in Haverhill.

Do we have an answer yet if she did take alcohol from the car? Renner states it was all accounted for when he talked to Haverhill PD, but I wonder why or if Haverhill is giving out information on an open investigation, AG's office should be checking that issue out.

just me wrote:

My dad was a drinker and when he did come around, he could turn on me fast. I was his favorite, but he did hit me a few times while drinking, for things he swore he'd have spanked me for if I were younger. He always thought he was justified since Mom was raising us alone and having troubles at times.
Mom would give him the boot as she didn't believe in hitting or spanking. Especially by a man who was an angry drinker.(can't bring myself to call him a drunk) because he passed away in 88, in my arms.

such a common thread running through society; sorry for you and others who have suffered, just me.

just me wrote:

Also, about that ATM picture(s)/video.....
What if it was not her taking out the money? Why not appeal to the public to help identify the person? Because this happened in MA, can't the police there show the picture to a family member? I realize they gave the case to NH, but certainly they must have a copy, just as they do have a copy of the hard drive. So frustrating!

right. could be that someone withdrew the $ for her or with her. the people who need to know (LE), know. and "family" representatives on Topix have clouded the issue over the years.

LE in this case as well as others seems to have a policy of not releasing anything they deem evidence regardless of how innocuous it is.

*it makes sense to me to keep an active, on-going investigation intact.*

PI Healy described Fred as " Volatile " according to an interview with Renner. I can't say he hit Maura, but I can sure see one heck of an A$$ chewing. Considering Maura's already seemingly fragile state that may have been the final straw for her to take a hiatus north.

*the nature of his relationship with his daughter, if volatile, is unconfirmed to the public, even if it was suspected to be so.*

As far as her hair being down, I don't read into that very much, I wonder if the airbag or contact the windshield blew the bun?
Like I said before being described as an overachiever these people tend to fall hard and she let her dad as well as herself down. We also are not truly sure what set of the crying episode or episodes. Also people who have issues with alcohol tend to fall back on it as a crutch during hard emotional times, who knows what Maura's condition was after the crash in Haverhill.
Do we have an answer yet if she did take alcohol from the car? Renner states it was all accounted for when he talked to Haverhill PD, but I wonder why or if Haverhill is giving out information on an open investigation, AG's office should be checking that issue out.

*it was circulating in the early days that she took some of the alcohol with her in a backpack. no doubt, this information is unverified. lots of red herrings along the way.*

just me wrote:

Also, about that ATM picture(s)/video.....
What if it was not her taking out the money? Why not appeal to the public to help identify the person? Because this happened in MA, can't the police there show the picture to a family member? I realize they gave the case to NH, but certainly they must have a copy, just as they do have a copy of the hard drive. So frustrating!

Does anyone remember where the original information came from pertaining to the family not being allowed to see the video?
It's beyond strange that at least one family member wasn't asked to view it to verify that it was indeed Maura.
Do we know if that ever changed later on and the video was eventually viewed?
If it hasn't been allowed to be viewed there must be one heck of a reason why not.

kitten wrote:

I'm sorry that the old forums are deleted, I'd really like to try and understand who has said what from the beginning. It's been my experience so far that the posters here, though some of them are skeptical the Murrays are revealing all they know, are respectful as possible.
There has been some flaming of locals and of Fred, but really it seems that everyone's on the same page: Fred could have behaved better; Maura was not perfect & was dealing with something major at the time of her disappearance; and the locals were unfairly thrown under the bus in the media-- both by FM & the police. We also all agree that this is unfair.
I've never physically searched for Maura. I've never filed for copies of reports or contacted any law enforcement officials. Many of you have, and for that I commend you. This is a place of discussions and ideas, and the fact that we remain civil to each other as often as we do speaks volumes about the smart & kindhearted people who post here. I believe that much with all my heart.
I post here tonight being somewhat sappy to people I don't know in hopes we might continue the discussions we've had in agreement that no one is perfect and in agreement to listen without judging too much. I for one pledge to clarify when I am being sarcastic & not to make any more grammar jokes at Citi's expense.
:)

Thanks for your thoughtful post Kitten, I don't think it is sappy.
I sure do wish the old posts were still available for everyone to read. Especially for those who complain about the bickering. That said, the newbies are free to click on the "X" at the right hand corner of their computer screen. Nobody is making them read here. And many have nothing to offer, or are too lazy to read up on the past 7 years. But I agree the bickering needs to end, it is non productive. I however am skeptical of any fruitful conversation as so much is unknown, so much is not fact, so much is questionable, so much will never be known. At this point all we can do is speculate. And so much points in different directions.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
Does anyone remember where the original information came from pertaining to the family not being allowed to see the video?
It's beyond strange that at least one family member wasn't asked to view it to verify that it was indeed Maura.
Do we know if that ever changed later on and the video was eventually viewed?
If it hasn't been allowed to be viewed there must be one heck of a reason why not.

Wowzer, I asked a family member, who is a retired detective about those circumstances. I just asked one question, "why would LE not use family to identify someone in a video that was missing" The response was (not knowing the details of the case) I would guess there is something incriminating in the video that they do not want family to see.

hannah_b wrote:

I would like to bring over a post from the comments section on Renner´s blog. While it is putting a family member in negative light, it could still hold a viable explanation for LE never to release the video of Maura at the ATM.
"Anonymous said...
>>> I do think its weird that BA said that the girl had her hair down that night when she frequently put her hair in a bun.
Ever since I read this bit of information several years ago I've wondered whether her father had slapped her around that night at the motel and she was trying to dissimulate the marks on her face. And remember, the police won't show the video at the ATM and at the liquor store the day she drove up North - do the videos show her face clearly? And no one saw Maura after the night at the motel, except her father, of course."

Hannah, I brought up this point a while back, that maybe Maura had a black eye or something. I think it fell on deaf ears. I probably got peanuts & white lightbulbs.

oo00oo wrote:

<quoted text>
Hannah, I brought up this point a while back, that maybe Maura had a black eye or something. I think it fell on deaf ears. I probably got peanuts & white lightbulbs.

Something´s fishy about that video. Compare this case to most other missing persons or even known murder cases with or without a body found. In lots of cases (most?) a "last seen" surveillance still or video is realeased to the public very early on, mostly even before they know anything other than the person is missing. Very strange, and I´m convinced there IS a reason.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Something´s fishy about that video. Compare this case to most other missing persons or even known murder cases with or without a body found. In lots of cases (most?) a "last seen" surveillance still or video is realeased to the public very early on, mostly even before they know anything other than the person is missing. Very strange, and I´m convinced there IS a reason.

Yes, this has been stated many times. How can UMASS police positively identify Maura. Did they personally know her? She was part of campus security, but why not ask family. The other alternative is that there is no video of her. If they have reason, I believe it is possible that it could be a lie. Why? No clue.

oo00oo wrote:

<quoted text>
Yes, this has been stated many times. How can UMASS police positively identify Maura. Did they personally know her? She was part of campus security, but why not ask family. The other alternative is that there is no video of her. If they have reason, I believe it is possible that it could be a lie. Why? No clue.

Almost sounds like some kind of coverup. Could a politician or someone with ties to high finance be involved? By "involved" I don´t necessarily mean to imply she was murdered, but that´s a possibility too...

oo00oo wrote:

<quoted text>
Thanks for your thoughtful post Kitten, I don't think it is sappy.
I sure do wish the old posts were still available for everyone to read. Especially for those who complain about the bickering. That said, the newbies are free to click on the "X" at the right hand corner of their computer screen. Nobody is making them read here. And many have nothing to offer, or are too lazy to read up on the past 7 years. But I agree the bickering needs to end, it is non productive. I however am skeptical of any fruitful conversation as so much is unknown, so much is not fact, so much is questionable, so much will never be known. At this point all we can do is speculate. And so much points in different directions.

no news until there is new news. everything has been raked over in as many years as she's been gone. better to be in the company of congenial bystanders than in the middle of an angry mob. i think we've found that happy medium.

oo00oo wrote:

<quoted text>
Yes, this has been stated many times. How can UMASS police positively identify Maura. Did they personally know her? She was part of campus security, but why not ask family. The other alternative is that there is no video of her. If they have reason, I believe it is possible that it could be a lie. Why? No clue.

do you recall if it has ever been established as some sort of fact that security/transaction videos actually existed at the bank and/or the liquor store?

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Almost sounds like some kind of coverup. Could a politician or someone with ties to high finance be involved? By "involved" I don´t necessarily mean to imply she was murdered, but that´s a possibility too...

Who knows. I guess if we knew who the other BF is, that would shed more light. But there are so many possibilities. Was she pregnant? Was her BF on the side married? Did he call her late at night (the 1am call) to end the relationship? Was he pissed that she might have been w/child? We can still keep going on and on. Will we ever know? I doubt it.