Maura Murray

aftermath wrote:

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Yes, I can see her now, in the liquor store. She was thinking, "Oh, yeah...must save some of this money to buy boots and winter clothing so once I'm real drunk I'll be able to slip into the forest to avoid any members of LE who might be lurking around." Maybe if intoxicated as some prefer to believe, she stripped down right there on the highway and changed into winter wear. Winter wear? Maybe even riding gear and rode off on one of Bill's legendary unicorns.

Wow. I guess some people are just born jerks. You know the ones that think they are smarter than everyone else.

Advocate wrote:

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Fail. RF did NOT say he saw a "girl" running. He said he saw a young person. RF never identified this person as MM. And IIRC, he did not say the person was running -- he said the person moved off the road or turned down a side road as he was approaching. The time was only about 8 PM, not terribly late and people are known to take walks even in cold weather (RobinsonOrdway walked to the Stage Stop), walk to or from a friend's home, etc. RF had no reason to stop.

thank you for correcting the record. it's a full-time job.

Snowy wrote:

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so, the "not stupid", "intelligent" "familiar with the outdoors" young woman who "valued her life" is the same one who ran away from college in February, sans appropriate winter clothing, and lied to excuse herself from her academic obligations.
intelligent people are not immune from lacking common sense or from getting into trouble with the law.
sorry, you can't convince this audience...try as you may...that MM was not acting on a plan, whether spontaneous or carefully crafted, to escape some dark situation in her personal life, as clearly evidenced by the emotions and behaviors she exhibited prior to her leaving Amherst; if, in fact, she ever made the trip to NH. i'll add she was not positively identified where her car was last found.
seems you've been sent to Topix via a successive line of quackers to promote positive attributes to MM which defy the choices she made in the time period during which she was last seen.
of course, you don't know her, haven't met her, and you're simply parroting what her family would like the public to believe.
perhaps Renner can and will uncover more fact-based information in researching the book he intends to write.

Snowy,
One thing you are correct about is that no one can convince you of Maura's personal qualities, characteristics. You are always in the attack mode when it comes to Maura. Having surfed websites for years regarding Maura's disappearance, it has occurred to me time and again that for whatever reason you hold great disdain for Maura. Your attitude toward Maura is similar to that of a woman scorned. True, others have made negative, derogatory comments about her. However, over time your comments have always reflected a deep, unusual level of contempt for Maura. It's as though you have some type of personal interest in this case other than finding Maura. It's as though you are protective of someone, some
thing.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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Wow. I guess some people are just born jerks. You know the ones that think they are smarter than everyone else.

Wow, Wowzer,
Seems like someone's wife has been helping him find the peanut butter!

aftermath wrote:

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jwb,
Then their was speculation the Saturn had slid off the same highway earlier that night, but as an officer(?) approached the scene, the car freed itself from being stuck and took off into the darkness. Whether this is true or not, whether this may have been Maura, it's difficult to determine. Some posts had indicated there had been lack of documentation by the officer (most likely because the car was leaving the scene!). Who knows if this is true?! Of course it was a busy evening according to some posters. Cars flying off the highway everywhere???????

***Then their was speculation the Saturn had slid off the same highway earlier that night, but as an officer(?) approached the scene, the car freed itself from being stuck and took off into the darkness***
That's the first I've heard of this so it's most likely more BS.
Someone said they heard of another accident on their scanner but they didn't remember it until quite some time later (weeks/months). No one else that I spoke to that had scanners heard it and there were no dispatch or police reports. If it was true the officer would have called in the plate number before leaving his car and that didn't happen or it would have been in dispatch log. Just a little more BS IMO.

aftermath wrote:

The only thing I question is why the person in the situation you describe wouldn't have had some curiosity as to why all of those people (searchers) were on the highway and wandering around the woods the following Wednesday (after Maura's disappearance)? Maybe, like Bill, he simply they were ALL intoxicated and attempting to avoid a DUI/DWI. Not that this doesn't happen (people DO attempt to avoid LE). However, a young woman, not dressed appropriately for hide and seek in a snowy forest on a winter's evening after dark will not do this.

I hear you... good point -- you know search teams have been out beginning on February 11 yet you neglect to come forward about a person you saw running in a desolate area 5 miles down the road on the day of disappearance... in mid-February.

Maybe:
1) You work from dawn to dusk at your day job and get totally smashed at night leaving absolutely no available time to call the police.
2) You are really busy for those few weeks and haven’t caught up with the disappearance. Once you find out a girl is missing you think you have your dates wrong. If you work odd days and not M-F this could happen.
3) You thought the person was a guy – thought you caught a glimpse of a goatee or facial hair so didn’t make the connection. It is only when you discover what MM was wearing that you connect-the-dots. BTW, The Whitman Hanson Express article (Part IV) says that RF saw a YOUNG WOMAN running but I’ve read elsewhere that RF said it was a guy.
4) Not your problem and you’re not in love with the local police force – or vice versa.
5) You are culpable in some way in this disappearance and you come forward to get LE to look in a direction further away from the true crime area.
6) You have a notion as to who may be involved in the disappearance and are afraid for your own well being if you come forward. Maybe you recall that a truck was parked along the side of the road and put 2 and 2 together a week later after the rumors start flying and feel it best to keep mum.

Bumping for Maura wrote:

Frostman and/or jwb,
A question for the locals here:
Having "driven" parts of Rtes 112 and 116 by way of Google Maps in the area of interest, I spotted what looks like a fairly big house at the very corner of the easterly 112/116 intersection.
Was this house there in February 2004 and, if so, is this a permanent residence or just a secondary one?
If Maura was in fact running in that area as possibly indicated by witness RF (The construction worker), either trying to flee an abductor or for some other reason, would she perhaps have been able to seek refuge in this house - or not?
Just wondering...

Yes I believe it was there then and no it's not a permanent residence.

Frostman wrote:
"I hear you... good point -- you know search teams have been out beginning on February 11 yet you neglect to come forward about a person you saw running in a desolate area 5 miles down the road on the day of disappearance... in mid-February."

Frostman,
Not only that, if I recall her family had been placing missing person posters of Maura all over the place, including in Bartlett. It took some people MONTHS later (not 3 or 4 weeks) to connect Maura to being the missing person... "Oh yeah....so SHE was the one who was missing," and ONLY after they were contacted. Posters everywhere you turn and yet all of these delays in reporting any bit of information. Too much herbal tea? Total oblivion? What? Maybe it was just the loud thunder of those unicorn hooves.

Frostman wrote:
"You are culpable in some way in this disappearance and you come forward to get LE to look in a direction further away from the true crime area."

Frostman,
Your comment makes me wonder if she might have been hit by a car. Some have said it was snowing that night, other say otherwise. In any event it was dark, so dark that people watching from their house had difficulty determining if the person with the Saturn was a woman or a man. Maura was wearing dark clothing and if she was walking, jogging a distance from the houses, possibly a driver never expected anyone to be on the road and hit her. Popped her into the trunk and tore off down the highway. Several possibilities exist.

Frostman wrote:

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I hear you... good point -- you know search teams have been out beginning on February 11 yet you neglect to come forward about a person you saw running in a desolate area 5 miles down the road on the day of disappearance... in mid-February.
Maybe:
1) You work from dawn to dusk at your day job and get totally smashed at night leaving absolutely no available time to call the police.
2) You are really busy for those few weeks and haven’t caught up with the disappearance. Once you find out a girl is missing you think you have your dates wrong. If you work odd days and not M-F this could happen.
3) You thought the person was a guy – thought you caught a glimpse of a goatee or facial hair so didn’t make the connection. It is only when you discover what MM was wearing that you connect-the-dots. BTW, The Whitman Hanson Express article (Part IV) says that RF saw a YOUNG WOMAN running but I’ve read elsewhere that RF said it was a guy.
4) Not your problem and you’re not in love with the local police force – or vice versa.
5) You are culpable in some way in this disappearance and you come forward to get LE to look in a direction further away from the true crime area.
6) You have a notion as to who may be involved in the disappearance and are afraid for your own well being if you come forward. Maybe you recall that a truck was parked along the side of the road and put 2 and 2 together a week later after the rumors start flying and feel it best to keep mum.

RF aka construction worker seemed to have a bit of confusion, I wondered the same thing many many posts ago. All that chaos by his house and he's oblivious to it? The only thing that I can fathom is he had his time confused and it was later than he thought that he saw Maura and all the LE and fire had left the scene.

Also wondered why he hadn't heard anything about it from neighbors or co-workers days following. But then again two people got killed in a wreck just down the road from me a few weeks ago and no one in the neighborhood mentioned a thing.

The fact that he felt the person was trying to hide should have raised red flags. Some people just don't want to get involved, matter of fact in many cases MANY people don't want to get involved.

Aftermath,
Maybe she was hit by a car, young kids, drinking, maybe from out-of-state. They put her in the car to take her to the hospital and she succumbs to her injuries en route. Maybe they’re trying to give her CPR up on BHR when the dog owner comes across them? They’re in enough trouble with mom and dad and don’t know what to do. They figure that if they leave her there and the dog walker has seen their plates the connection will be made back to them. But if they take her with them… Maybe they are children of a local official…

But where did it happen? Maybe they swerved to avoid hitting her car and hit her. FW has gone hack to watching Jeopardy! after BA, the SDB is on scene. And BA is now inside his house trying to call the police.

Maybe that’s the same truck RO saw and the kids were just sloshed. You always get a creepy feeling if a car stops and looks at you. Especially on a dark country road…

NHwoodsman52,

Sometimes people are too busy surviving to notice what's going on around them. Especially in winter -- people aren't out mowing lawns and chatting.

Another scenario -- You’re on your way home along Rte. 112 from your contracting job. You don’t spot someone running along the road or anywhere else for that matter on that Monday night. But you do spy a vehicle with both doors open and nobody around. Maybe you recognize the vehicle, maybe not. You just reckon a couple of beer drinking blokes are having a potty break.

You don’t find out about the fender-bender up the road or a missing girl or the search until you get home on Wednesday night or even until the weekend. You don’t connect the truck to the missing girl until you (later) either hear about RO’s encounter with a red truck or find out about the dog owner seeing suspicious behavior up on BHR.

If you know who owns the truck and are afraid of that person you say nothing. If somebody warns you to stay out of it – don’t get involved, you say nothing.

But after FM and LE many others come knocking at your door your conscience gets the better of you. You want to point everyone in the general direction, but you don’t want to get in trouble or killed by the perp. who owns the truck. So it's late April, early May. By now you have learned that the missing girl is a runner (jogger). So you say:“I might have seen someone – a guy, a girl jogging down that way sometime during that week back in February. Let me check my work schedule for that week.” That way you clear your conscience and maybe they’ll find some clues near where you saw the open-door truck.

Of course that then backfires because now you look like an uncaring sod who wouldn’t stop your car for another human being who might have been in peril. So you sell your house and move away.

(Can’t wait for Snowy Owl to get his talons into this one.)

mauracomehome wrote:

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Why were you even considered? Have others on the forum been asked?what made you suspect?

No real idea. I can make some guesses, but that's about it. As far as I know, no one else on any of the forums has acknowledged same. As I stated earlier, the PI made his initial request on an Amherst MA Topix thread. Could have been for a million reasons, good or bad. Maybe he was just curious. Maybe he is working for someone anxious to obscure potential clues. But it was definitely one of most unusual conversations I've ever had. The main thing I took away from it is that at least some of the focus is on Amherst MA - maybe specifically on me, maybe not.

So many thought-provoking posts in the last few hours only!
The trouble with Maura´s case, as I see it, is primarily that there are a myriad of various, more or less equally possible explanations for her vanishing:

1. Hit-and run accident in which she succumbed.
2. Abducted and killed by a maniac.
3. Succumbed to the cold/hypothermia.
4. Runaway-case, possibly living a "new" life somewhere.
5. A case of suicide.
6. Death by accident other than a hit-and-run.
7. The possibility, however small, that it might not have been Maura at the Saturn speaking with the SBD Butch Atwood.

Have I forgotten another possibility here?

Also:
The mysterious red truck as observed by witness RO on Rte 112 in Swiftwater village and the possibility that the same truck was observed by the witness out with a dog on Bradley Hill Road:
1. Driven by a friend/friends of Maura´s?
2. Driven by a perp?
3. Just a co-incidence - nothing to do with Maura.

The supposed observation by RF (The construction worker) of someone walking/jogging/running on Rte 112 or Rte 116 some five miles east of the accident scene:
1. A complete fabrication by RF for whatever reason?
2. Some kind of half-truth?
3. This is just the way it was and RF is telling the truth 100%.

Even if 3. above is indeed correct, we can´t be absolutely certain that it was indeed Maura that RF observed in the dark for probably no more than a few seconds, just as we cannot be absolutely certain that the young lady at the Saturn was Maura.

Yet another thing:
The supposed find of hair and duct-tape some 7.8 miles east of the accident scene at a spot which according to several posters here is being frequently used by many hunters in the season.
1. Possible indication of Maura having been kept captive by a perp?
2. Nothing at all to do with Maura, but just some things left by a hunter.
3. The witness "Matthew" just made the whole thing up for whatever reason.

There are so many different possible equations to Maura´s perplexing case and connecting the dots without some further information is infuriatingly difficult to put it mildly.

mauracomehome wrote:

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Why were you even considered?Have others on the forum been asked?what made you suspect?

Post 2200 and 2201 on the Amherst MA Topix, 21 Feb 2011.

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/amherst-ma/TD...

It wasn't until Friday early afternoon of Memorial Day weekend that I finally met with him on a bench outside of Target in Hadley.

It's summer 2008 and you're real polite and patiently talk to a UMass police officer who's biking next to Kennedy dorm. You show him a photo of the Saturn with the sticker (2003-2004 academic year) on it and ask him where it would have been parked. Just 3-4 minutes normal conversation and that's it. Origin of question explained - how long to drive from Lot 12 or SW to Triangle and Mattoon and back. A few days later you receive a no-trespass order covering all UMass property in Massachusetts.

Isn't that kind of an extreme reaction by UMass PD? When asked why the order, no answer provided. No explanation, just an unspoken "don't come back and ask any more questions." Maybe I have a "twin" who's not such a nice guy. I've heard of ID theft, but this is rediculous.

Bumping for Maura wrote:

So many thought-provoking posts in the last few hours only!
The trouble with Maura´s case, as I see it, is primarily that there are a myriad of various, more or less equally possible explanations for her vanishing:
1. Hit-and run accident in which she succumbed.
2. Abducted and killed by a maniac.
3. Succumbed to the cold/hypothermia.
4. Runaway-case, possibly living a "new" life somewhere.
5. A case of suicide.
6. Death by accident other than a hit-and-run.
7. The possibility, however small, that it might not have been Maura at the Saturn speaking with the SBD Butch Atwood.
Have I forgotten another possibility here?
Also:
The mysterious red truck as observed by witness RO on Rte 112 in Swiftwater village and the possibility that the same truck was observed by the witness out with a dog on Bradley Hill Road:
1. Driven by a friend/friends of Maura´s?
2. Driven by a perp?
3. Just a co-incidence - nothing to do with Maura.
The supposed observation by RF (The construction worker) of someone walking/jogging/running on Rte 112 or Rte 116 some five miles east of the accident scene:
1. A complete fabrication by RF for whatever reason?
2. Some kind of half-truth?
3. This is just the way it was and RF is telling the truth 100%.
Even if 3. above is indeed correct, we can´t be absolutely certain that it was indeed Maura that RF observed in the dark for probably no more than a few seconds, just as we cannot be absolutely certain that the young lady at the Saturn was Maura.
Yet another thing:
The supposed find of hair and duct-tape some 7.8 miles east of the accident scene at a spot which according to several posters here is being frequently used by many hunters in the season.
1. Possible indication of Maura having been kept captive by a perp?
2. Nothing at all to do with Maura, but just some things left by a hunter.
3. The witness "Matthew" just made the whole thing up for whatever reason.
There are so many different possible equations to Maura´s perplexing case and connecting the dots without some further information is infuriatingly difficult to put it mildly.

Good summary, but if you lived here you'd give more weight to Amherst. Not discounting any of the many possibilities in Haverhil NH. Just saying there is a beehive of activity in the Amherst MA area also.

If a group of pro-life, anti-abortion people from the Amherst MA area suggest you know what happened to Maura, what does that say?

aftermath wrote:

Frostman wrote:
"I hear you... good point -- you know search teams have been out beginning on February 11 yet you neglect to come forward about a person you saw running in a desolate area 5 miles down the road on the day of disappearance... in mid-February."
Frostman,
Not only that, if I recall her family had been placing missing person posters of Maura all over the place, including in Bartlett. It took some people MONTHS later (not 3 or 4 weeks) to connect Maura to being the missing person... "Oh yeah....so SHE was the one who was missing," and ONLY after they were contacted. Posters everywhere you turn and yet all of these delays in reporting any bit of information. Too much herbal tea? Total oblivion? What? Maybe it was just the loud thunder of those unicorn hooves.

The shopkeeper overheard the Construction worker making mention of the person he saw the night of the accident. That he remembered seeing somebody with a hoodie dashing along while driving home from his job in Franconia. The shopkeeper then told Fred, who then told police. They immediately cancelled a planned search for that section where the sighting occured.

What's the general opinion in Haverhill NH of its former and disgraced police chief?