Maura Murray

Snowy wrote:

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no. there has not been written confirmation, to my knowledge, of a flat tire in MM's case. this piece of info was debated with "Columbo" on this forum. if he is your source, which you haven't linked, then i dispute it.

Snowy,
It sounds like you might be attempting to protect someone? Wonder who the knight may be? Seems many have a fairly good idea by now Snowy, given what brings you and your kind out in unison on this site that something stinks about this case. Maura's car had a flat tire, that's why ALL pictures of the lower portion of her car have been removed from all websites. There is a strong possibility that someone tampered with one of the tires on her car. This may be why the car left the road. Pamela Webb had been attempting to change a tire on her truck when abducted. It is obvious that photos of certain angles of Brianna's car have been pulled off websites. Possibly it is not one individual who is responsible for these women having met with foul play. It sounds more like some type of organized situation. Something stinks in VT and NH and the stench does not appear to be clearing. It only intensifies.

aftermath wrote:

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Snowy,
It sounds like you might be attempting to protect someone? Wonder who the knight may be? Seems many have a fairly good idea by now Snowy, given what brings you and your kind out in unison on this site that something stinks about this case. Maura's car had a flat tire, that's why ALL pictures of the lower portion of her car have been removed from all websites. There is a strong possibility that someone tampered with one of the tires on her car. This may be why the car left the road. Pamela Webb had been attempting to change a tire on her truck when abducted. It is obvious that photos of certain angles of Brianna's car have been pulled off websites. Possibly it is not one individual who is responsible for these women having met with foul play. It sounds more like some type of organized situation. Something stinks in VT and NH and the stench does not appear to be clearing. It only intensifies.

So now your theory is that someone is going around tampering with the tires of young woman and then somehow removing the pictures of their cars from the internet so no one can see the flat tires? And it's may be organized by more than one person? Is this what you're saying ? Holy crap, you must sleep with a gun under your pillow at night.

just me wrote:
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The shopkeeper overheard the Construction worker making mention of the person he saw the night of the accident. That he remembered seeing somebody with a hoodie dashing along while driving home from his job in Franconia. The shopkeeper then told Fred, who then told police. They immediately cancelled a planned search for that section where the sighting occured.

Just Me,
The construction worker is the gentlemen who lived alone near the accident scene? I notice the words "credible witness" whenever reference is made to him. Does anyone know how credibility was determined? The other situation that appears to drift off into thin air is that on several occasions it's mentioned that Maura had phoned one of the dorm rooms on the day she disappeared. Follow-up on that call has always ended something to the effect, "that person (person who resided in the dorm room) probably moved on...." What does it matter if the person moved on. It would seem important to know who had resided in the room at the time Maura had phoned.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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So now your theory is that someone is going around tampering with the tires of young woman and then somehow removing the pictures of their cars from the internet so no one can see the flat tires? And it's may be organized by more than one person? Is this what you're saying ? Holy crap, you must sleep with a gun under your pillow at night.

Wowzer,
Tire tampering is not anything new. This is done all over the country...it eventually disables the vehicle and renders the driver vulnerable to being victimized. With the 18 meth labs that were shut down in Graft Co, organized criminal activity would not be out of range of possibilities. Maybe the victims were being coerced in some way, threatened, USED by those involved in drug trafficking. Many victims are from out of state and fit the profile of someone who would not be suspected.

Quite a few people saw the Saturn at the accident site and after being towed. LE, tow truck driver, even Fred Murray and Billy Rausch, to mention a few. None of them ever mentioned a flat tire. The flat tire story originated with Det Columbo, who admittedly didn´t see the Saturn until more than a year after the accident. Det Columbo has been known to throw out red herrings far and wide.

Mr Renner seems to have looked into the first accident rumor, and claimed there was no "first accident". I believe him. For now, I´m going with the Sasquatch theory.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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So now your theory is that someone is going around tampering with the tires of young woman and then somehow removing the pictures of their cars from the internet so no one can see the flat tires? And it's may be organized by more than one person? Is this what you're saying ? Holy crap, you must sleep with a gun under your pillow at night.

Wowzer,
I bet you're thinking about convincing me that a tire is not flat on the bottom only, right? Don't most people today travel, sleep with a handgun, or rifle nearby? Why are gun sales up?...and do not attempt to convince me otherwise. Sales have increased significantly. Even those who have never had any interest in weapons now own guns...at least one or more! This is what makes America great. Gun laws and the NRA. Where have you BEEN, Wowzer?! Please don't tell me that you don't own a handgun. Today even grandmothers are down at the firing range!

hannah_b wrote:

Quite a few people saw the Saturn at the accident site and after being towed. LE, tow truck driver, even Fred Murray and Billy Rausch, to mention a few. None of them ever mentioned a flat tire. The flat tire story originated with Det Columbo, who admittedly didn´t see the Saturn until more than a year after the accident. Det Columbo has been known to throw out red herrings far and wide.
Mr Renner seems to have looked into the first accident rumor, and claimed there was no "first accident". I believe him. For now, I´m going with the Sasquatch theory.

Hannah,
Fred and Billy did not arrive at the scene until long after the Saturn had been moved away from the scene of the accident. I find Detective Columbo and Beagle to be quite knowledgeable and well informed.

aftermath wrote:

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Hannah,
Fred and Billy did not arrive at the scene until long after the Saturn had been moved away from the scene of the accident. I find Detective Columbo and Beagle to be quite knowledgeable and well informed.

I am aware Fred and Billy didn´t see the car until Wednesday, however noone ever reported seeing a flat tire, except for Det Columbo who only saw the car more than a year later. How do we know the flat tire didn´t happen sometime in the 1+ year after the accident? Det Columbo is full of shit and has been known to flat out lie on forums. Of course Beagle knows all about it. He was the one who killed Maura, if you believe in PIs.

aftermath wrote:

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NHwoodsman,
In at least one of the previous accidents, it seems as though she'd left a party and it might be reasonable to assume drinks might have been available at a party. Still she had not run away from the accident that occurred after she left the party. It was late, surely an officer would have been curious as to whether she'd been drinking?...and who knows who threw a cup under the car (Route 112). Just about everything at the scene of that accident on Route 112, seemed to be quite compromised. The Saturn was not immediately impounded...in fact it was towed off to a local garage. The car and area were not treated as a crime scene. It was treated as an abandoned vehicle situation.

The accidents were different in the respect that she didn't have alcohol splattered inside her dads car and a soda bottle that had alcohol in it. She would be smart enough to see that LE would assume she had been drinking in the Haverhill accident where as in the Hadley accident she may well have felt they would suspect nothing and stayed at the scene. She may also have felt that Hadley PD may be more lenient than Haverhill which it appears they may have. Two total different sets of circumstances.

aftermath wrote:

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NHwoodsman52,
Remember someone mentioning that they felt Maura might have been afraid of Mr. A because of his appearance (he was a very large man).

She indicated to Mr. Atwood she called AAA and didn't want him to call police and that she called AAA.f Maura was that frightened and being smart as you have stated she is, she would have told Butch she called PD and they were in route.

just me wrote:

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As far as the female sliding off the road and getting into a private vehicle goes. Joe Blow could have been driving along with his own scanner on and talking over the waves about what he just saw. Didn't nec·es·sar·i·ly have to be phoned in to police.....Just Scanner chatter....hmmmmm.
It was Anne who was boiling potatos that heard something to this effect. It caught her attention because of her friend with little experience in bad weather. Anne was afraid it could have been that friend and that's why the info stuck. It seems reasonable enough to be believable. That and well, Anne seems sincere.
I can think of a couple of instances where somebody saw or heard about Maura Murray and told people they may have seen her after the fact. Like the cumberland Farm store experience. The woman, upon hearing the news of Maura was haunted for quite some time that she may have seen Maura with an older guy mouthing the words "help me"

The Hillsboro NH incident with the girl mouthing " help me" has pretty much been eliminated as Maura. Ironically I am very close to Hillsboro and I know one of the woman who worked there and she was a few french fries short of a happy meal. I don't know if she was the one that reported this, but this woman lived on my road for a few years.

There also was a girl that could have been Maura's twin that worked at Shaws supermarket and wore her hair the same way. The real give away she wasn't Maura was her dimples weren't as pronounced as Maura's and I'm not sure about the eye color.

The Cumberlands incident happened quite a while after Maura disappeared, just more drama. I believe Hillsboro PD concluded it wasn't her.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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So now your theory is that someone is going around tampering with the tires of young woman and then somehow removing the pictures of their cars from the internet so no one can see the flat tires? And it's may be organized by more than one person? Is this what you're saying ? Holy crap, you must sleep with a gun under your pillow at night.

HEY, what's wrong with sleeping with a gun under the pillow, a guy never knows when the wife might get frisky and refuse to take no for an answer. Then the gun comes in handy!

hannah_b wrote:

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I am aware Fred and Billy didn´t see the car until Wednesday, however noone ever reported seeing a flat tire, except for Det Columbo who only saw the car more than a year later. How do we know the flat tire didn´t happen sometime in the 1+ year after the accident? Det Columbo is full of shit and has been known to flat out lie on forums. Of course Beagle knows all about it. He was the one who killed Maura, if you believe in PIs.

Geez, after sitting a year, Hannah has it right!! A slow leak isn't uncommon in tires, Columbo should have realized that if he made a statement someone flattened her tire to disable her vehicle it was irresponsible. Talk about jumping to conclusions with no facts to back it up. Its this type of BS that does nothing more than to muddy the water and can impede an investigation.

aftermath wrote:

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Wowzer,
I bet you're thinking about convincing me that a tire is not flat on the bottom only, right? Don't most people today travel, sleep with a handgun, or rifle nearby? Why are gun sales up?...and do not attempt to convince me otherwise. Sales have increased significantly. Even those who have never had any interest in weapons now own guns...at least one or more! This is what makes America great. Gun laws and the NRA. Where have you BEEN, Wowzer?! Please don't tell me that you don't own a handgun. Today even grandmothers are down at the firing range!

Well you got me. I do carry a gun and can shoot the eye of a mosquito at 100 yards. The only time I carry it though is if I'm off in the woods alone walking or fishing in secluded areas. I wouldn't want to run into a rogue bear or a hungry pack of coyotes and not have protection with me. I'm much too slow to outrun them.
And no I don't sleep with a handgun, it's much too cold.

aftermath wrote:

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Hannah,
Fred and Billy did not arrive at the scene until long after the Saturn had been moved away from the scene of the accident. I find Detective Columbo and Beagle to be quite knowledgeable and well informed.

**I find Detective Columbo and Beagle to be quite knowledgeable and well informed.**
Well that explains everything!

NHwoodsman52 wrote:

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Geez, after sitting a year, Hannah has it right!! A slow leak isn't uncommon in tires, Columbo should have realized that if he made a statement someone flattened her tire to disable her vehicle it was irresponsible. Talk about jumping to conclusions with no facts to back it up. Its this type of BS that does nothing more than to muddy the water and can impede an investigation.

DC was caught in a couple of his lies, one being the red truck up on BHR. Didn't happen.
And when he stated that people came running out of their houses with guns drawn when he pulled in their driveways some of us about fell out of the chair laughing. It's still a good joke to tell when the locals get together.

Fluffly the cat ate her.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text> Sorry just me, I don't buy it. I listen to the scanner every day and sometimes it's very active which makes it hard to tell which town is talking unless you're listening in total concentration.
It's hard to believe that someone can remember hearing about a car off the road months or even weeks later.Even if her friend was driving that night how can someone remember the time,date and what was said and come forward weeks/months later suddenly remembering it?
The public cannot talk on the scanner. We can only listen. There was nothing on the dispatch logs or any police report and no one heard it but Anne so IMHO there wasn't another accident.

Thanks for giving your point of view. I used to have a two way radio, called myself "bashful blond" Well, I quit using it the time a guy I was chatting with said he could see me in the parking lot. That was enough for me to think maybe something like this could have happened. But, you're making sense to me here. I have a police scanner myself and you're right, I can't cut in. I was only thinking of the good old days and missed that part.
As for Anne remembering the time and such, so many days later, I guess I agree more with you now. Here's why. Det Columbo and a couple i won't name likely helped to bring it out of her more, to fit with their stories (because I've read alot of their stories), and why they would do such a thing is beyond me. making it look like it happened somewhere else, having a flat, the no, no, no, please don't story.....well, what could the reason be?

But the mind is tricky Wowzer. Sometimes it's like deyzhavous (LOL), and we think "oh wow, I was right there and I heard it, but it didn't click until now. My food was cooking. My friend always drove home passing near that slick part of town at exactly 7 o'clock..........I don't know

Didn't that cumberland farms lady come on Topix once and say that she had to take it all back, that one of the detectives put her up to it....coming on Topix and telling her story?

All this does in my mind is suggest that Maura is alive and we should never stall in looking for her. Reminds me of the call to Billy. I always felt that once they knew it came from a red cross caller and that they did in fact have Billy's cellphone number, it was to keep her alive and keep the search on. Sneaky? And if so, maybe they just want to know where she's hiding...JMO

Wowzer the real one wrote:

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DC was caught in a couple of his lies, one being the red truck up on BHR. Didn't happen.
And when he stated that people came running out of their houses with guns drawn when he pulled in their driveways some of us about fell out of the chair laughing. It's still a good joke to tell when the locals get together.

Oh my gosh, that's too funny and you gotta be kidding. The red truck story was made up? Wow. What a waste of time. Thanks for telling us, or at least me because I really thought that was true. Never been stopped before about it. And from now on I will not even think or wonder along those lines.

Was the cottage worker story made up too? Surely by now someone may know who that "witness" is/was?

just me wrote:

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Oh my gosh, that's too funny and you gotta be kidding. The red truck story was made up? Wow. What a waste of time. Thanks for telling us, or at least me because I really thought that was true. Never been stopped before about it. And from now on I will not even think or wonder along those lines.
Was the cottage worker story made up too? Surely by now someone may know who that "witness" is/was?

Just me, I believe Wowzer is referring to the sighting of a red truck up Bradley Hill Rd as being fake. RO´s sighting of a red truck I believe is legit. Or did I get it wrong, Wowzer?