Maura Murray

Rod wrote:

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I didn't say she ran away, but that she was running, and then its anyone's guess what happened afterwards. Probably frightened rather than shivering. Even if you knew the person who was going to pick you up, you would probably be on edge if you had just crashed your car (intentionally or not). The combination of flurry of activity and rag in tailpipe always made me think that someone else was there and that person was not abducting her, and that she was going with this person willingly, even if hesitantly.

Okay lets go with that theory.....the fact that the father doesn't blow his top while being told about the rag, and he says he told her to put it there to make the car stop smoking. If anyone was picking her up it would have been him he made it a point to tell police that he knew about, and touched the rag at one point. MAybe his blood was on it or something.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>she ran away is not fact. it is only speculation. no one knows why and if she left Amherst willingly. there are to many unknowns about Amherst.

are you suggesting she was abducted from UMASS Amherst, then?

Tom wrote:

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Maitland had a drug problem you can't really compare her case to Maura Murrays. When drugs are involved it is too close to the under ground because of the shady people.

Shady people like Lt. Campbell of the Mass. State Police (Norwell barracks), who helped Cape Cod real estate entrepreneur Ron Rudnick steal back, FROM THE S. YARMOUTH STATE POLICE BARRACKS, many, many bales of marijuana seized when brought ashore by people working for Rudnick. This is late 70s, early 80s. Rudnick received zero jail time. Campbell spent a relatively short time in jail.

Or how about that other fine, upstanding Mass State Poice lieutenant who, working one night at the Hampden County DA's office, found an Asst. DA looking through some files that didn't, shall we say, reflect well on the good Lt. This good Lt. decided to kill, with a knife, the Asst. DA. The Asst DA was able to pull a fire alarm. Good Lt. arrested, sent to jail.

And these are MSP lieutenants! Shady people can spend years behind the tin and the public is none the wiser.

Tom wrote:

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Maitland had a drug problem you can't really compare her case to Maura Murrays. When drugs are involved it is too close to the under ground because of the shady people.

How do you know that Maura didn't have a drug problem? Only not pot, or coke, or heroin - not the usual street drugs, but maybe she had a problem with drugs commonly available to and used by athletes. Maybe someone found her dead in her apartment one day, dead from having used certain performance enhancing drugs, or weight loss drugs, or whatever kind of drugs, and didn't want to be associated with her so she ditched Maura's body and simply got the car as far away as possible.

Lots of things are possible in Amherst. Too many things. Just ask Lt. Ronald Young of the Amherst PD.

Snowy wrote:

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are you suggesting she was abducted from UMASS Amherst, then?

Not trying to answer for citigirl, but maybe Maura was in a big jam, way over her head. Maybe it was something out of nowhere or maybe it had been building for a while. Maybe she believed she was not only leaving Amherst but was going to return. Maybe she felt desperate, compelled to keep the trip a secret. Maybe she never got farther than Lot 12. Maybe she left with someone and something happened between her departure from Amherst and the WB curve. Lots of maybe this, maybe that, but it is far from certain, or even highly probable that Maura was in fact at the WB curve.

Snowy wrote:

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are you suggesting she was abducted from UMASS Amherst, then?

I have not suggested anything. just stated there are unknowns about Amherst.

Snowy wrote:

is it ok to point to the SBD, but not ok to point to FM?

Most of the violence occurs between family, friends or acquiantances. Most victims know their attacker, and the attacker has a reason for doing it.

Who is known for his violent temper? FM not SBD.

Beagle wrote:

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How do you know that Maura didn't have a drug problem? Only not pot, or coke, or heroin - not the usual street drugs, but maybe she had a problem with drugs commonly available to and used by athletes. Maybe someone found her dead in her apartment one day, dead from having used certain performance enhancing drugs, or weight loss drugs, or whatever kind of drugs, and didn't want to be associated with her so she ditched Maura's body and simply got the car as far away as possible.
Lots of things are possible in Amherst. Too many things. Just ask Lt. Ronald Young of the Amherst PD.

I don't know if she did. But I know Maitland did and that was because her friends knew she associated with Drug dealers and used drugs. That is known in the Maitland case.

We can't introduce conspiracy theories about Mauras vanishing. At some point you have to look at the information thats on hand and not introduce wild and crazy theories. Again as I stated the LE have a pretty good lead but for whatever reason can't close this case out.

FrmLE wrote:

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I question your skillzzz, lol. Because, who knows what skills you supposedly have? Seriously, you are probably a 450lb fat man sitting on your couch eating cheetos and drinking Dr.Pepper in your moms basement.
Who knows? Prove you aren't then maybe we can begin talking about your 'skillz', lol
What a tool, they come along so often.

I see you're still pissing on the graves of NHSP Troopers Scott Phillips and Leslie Lord.

Maura may have left Amherst after having been deceived about the true nature of a trip north. She may have had every intention of returning. She may have believed that the trip was certainly not a break, a time to chill. She may have believed that the trip was necessary even if it was wrong or illegal. She may have fully expected to return and resume her life at UMass. Lots of possibilities besides the very valid one of perishing in the woods near the WB curve.

Beagle wrote:

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Not trying to answer for citigirl, but maybe Maura was in a big jam, way over her head. Maybe it was something out of nowhere or maybe it had been building for a while. Maybe she believed she was not only leaving Amherst but was going to return. Maybe she felt desperate, compelled to keep the trip a secret. Maybe she never got farther than Lot 12. Maybe she left with someone and something happened between her departure from Amherst and the WB curve. Lots of maybe this, maybe that, but it is far from certain, or even highly probable that Maura was in fact at the WB curve.

a) she was last seen at a party on/near UMASS Amherst campus
b) after she informed the UMASS nursing program of her leaving (and lying about a death in the family)
c) her images were captured on videos making a purchase of liquors and withdrawing funds from an ATM
e) she was last seen by a witness, SBD, at a location with her crashed car in NH

* it is logical and accurate to conclude MM left (or ran away from) UMASS Amherst
* as it is known she did so following an upset/emotional meltdown witnessed following a phone conversation; she also crashed her father's car
* it is also known she and her car arrived at its final location in NH

now, what was the question?

Tom wrote:

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At some point you have to look at the information thats on hand and not introduce wild and crazy theories.

You mean alternate theories?

What information is on hand, exactly?

What makes you think LE holds all the cards?

Rod wrote:

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Why is it so ridiculous to think FM knows what happened?
Do you know him?
Don't you know that it is highly more probable that it was someone who was closer to her (family, very close friend) than anyone else. This is LE 101.
The first POI will be the person who had the most contact with her recently.

The last person she spent any amount of time with was Fred in his motel room. 3AM Sat- sometime Sun afternoon. What is Fred's alibi? LE was unable to reach him via cellphone.

Snowy wrote:

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a) she was last seen at a party on/near UMASS Amherst campus
b) after she informed the UMASS nursing program of her leaving (and lying about a death in the family)
c) her images were captured on videos making a purchase of liquors and withdrawing funds from an ATM
e) she was last seen by a witness, SBD, at a location with her crashed car in NH
* it is logical and accurate to conclude MM left (or ran away from) UMASS Amherst
* as it is known she did so following an upset/emotional meltdown witnessed following a phone conversation; she also crashed her father's car
* it is also known she and her car arrived at its final location in NH
now, what was the question?

SBD's indentification is unreliable. It is certainly very possible that Maura was at the Saturn's "final location in NH," but it is not truly known that Maura was there.

Some years back in Greenfield MA an older gentleman went into the Ink Well newsstand on Federal St to get his morning paper. When he came out, a young guy carjacked him and recklessly drove the car and its owner nearly to MCI Concord. Both were almost killed more than once on that trip before being stop-sticked by the police. Cars get stolen, sometimes when their owners or usual operaters are with the cars. Sometimes those car owners get hurt or killed. It's not necessary that an assailant was male. Plenty of women around here can punch most men's lights out.

Snowy wrote:

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a) she was last seen at a party on/near UMASS Amherst campus

She was last reliably seen by the Hadley MA officer who responded to the Corolla crash.

Tom wrote:

<quoted text>We can't introduce conspiracy theories about Mauras vanishing.

Prosecutors, especially federal prosecutors, introduce conspiracy theories all the time. Political corruption cases are almost always prosecuted on the basis of a conspiracy, not to mention the frequent and sole use of circumstantial evidence.

And then there are two really grand conspiracy theories like Watergate and Iran-Contra.

A conspiracy involves two or more people who materially plan a crime. The crime does not have to be executed, just planned beyond the mere talking stage.

whitenoise wrote:

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The last person she spent any amount of time with was Fred in his motel room. 3AM Sat- sometime Sun afternoon. What is Fred's alibi? LE was unable to reach him via cellphone.

How is this known for sure? Beyond a newspaper story or the like.

Beagle wrote:

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You mean alternate theories?
What information is on hand, exactly?
What makes you think LE holds all the cards?

Maybe I'm just the only one who is speculating on what LE has, but we have to assume that they have more info than we do. I have posted numerous times that MM father who has constantly fought with LE during the whole case, didn't sit down and do a formal interview until 2 years after the case and he brought lawyers. I don't know why he would delay that so long if any info he has can help find her.......I also think MM father knows more about why she went went missing.

LE - probably has: pictures of MM at the ATM and liquor store. MAybe security footage of the gas station. DNA evidence of the rag found in the exhaust. PErhaps a full search and lab make up of Maura's fathers rental car. Maybe a reservation is his name in the area where Maura went missing.

If you want to stick to the facts, then stick to the hard, cold, actual facts. Apply the same standards to yourself as to others. It is a seductive assumption that Maura was at the WB curve.

There are very few things positively known by the public which immediately surround Maura's disappearance, but there are definitely some things that have happened even years later - offline, out of public view - that indicate she may not have left Amherst voluntarily to perish in the NH woods.

Beagle wrote:

<quoted text>Prosecutors, especially federal prosecutors, introduce conspiracy theories all the time. Political corruption cases are almost always prosecuted on the basis of a conspiracy, not to mention the frequent and sole use of circumstantial evidence.
And then there are two really grand conspiracy theories like Watergate and Iran-Contra.
A conspiracy involves two or more people who materially plan a crime. The crime does not have to be executed, just planned beyond the mere talking stage.

Okay this isn't a conspiracy I think the FBI would be more active in this case.....Maybe we should more plausable reasons of disappearance like alien abduction, or she had to leave her car there on the road to visit her friend in Atlantis.