Maura Murray

anonymousone wrote:

I think for the first year Fred Murray was up there almost every single weekend but I do think he likely doesn't go up as often unless he gets a tip of some sort. Honestly it sounds like to me that he searched pretty much everywhere he could up and down that road.
One other thing worth mentioning is the A-frame house. Why haven't the police looked into why a body was in there? Even if it was not Maura Murray there was still apparently a body in a house. Is something wrong with this picture?

there wasn't necessarily a body in there....per Shack, it was menstrual fluid that was scented

looking4amoose wrote:

<quoted text>Shack, that PIA caused my dog to go THROUGH my sliding glass doors when HE and his compadres were searching on my property without my PERMISSION. Did he even OPFFER to pay for the damages to my house or the dogs vet bills? No he didn't--all he did was get in his car and drive away. THAT is one of the many reasons the area residents spoke of Fred that way.

Did you actually have a face-to-face conversation with Mr. Murray and ask him why he might have been on your property in the first place? I guess you were able to halt you dog at the time or did he stop on his own? Was he agitated by humans in his territory or was he protecting his home from the search dogs? It sounds as if you were attempting to have a chat with Mr. Murray and he simply got into his car and drove off. Did he not ask you about any possible information that you might have heard or seen regarding the disappearance of his daughter?

looking4amoose wrote:

<quoted text>No Citi, I do not see Fred there every weekend searching the way the media has protrayed it. I did not see Fred....my husband talked to people later who were involved in renting the Lodge to the group saidd it was Fred and his cohorts. If I had seen him, I would've let the dog loose on him. There are clearly posted Beware of Dog signs as well as no trespassing signs posted.....had my dog torn his ass up it would not have been my fault.

So, you didn't see Fred (Murray) at all?

What is this all about? Are you just trying to get compensation for a broken window and vet. bills or do you have proof that there were trespassers?

looking4amoose wrote:

<quoted text>Bill et al.---don't think I'm a special person at all. I'm a person that cares about society in general and individual that TRIES to see the good in everyone. I'm an RN working in the community--I encounter all kinds of personalities and have to "meet them where they are" to be able to relate to the circumstances that led them to their medical or psychiatric dilemma that forces them to have a medical professional in their home for themself or for their child.

I would agree. You are not special. But you are a very decent human being. So was SBD. Both of you have paid a price for being involved in this case. Shack was one of the people that mostly caused the SBD the problems he had by accusations with no basis in fact, as well as the rest of the community at large. Even after it was reported he was not a person of interest she still continued with her accusations. There are some people like Shack who feel that any transgression in the name of "justice" is perfectly justified. She has said as much. Whether it was Fred or his representatives or just some whack job who figures anything they do is justified to help Fred, like Shack, makes little difference. You, your living space, property and dog were all violated and it was wrong.

Shack has mostly stayed away from this forum and I think that is a very good thing. She still carries the stink of what she did apparently without even the slightest remorse. Those once or twice a month she pops in I can usually ignore her as most seem to do. Her legacy.

I have respect looking4amoose for what you do. Thanks.

Bill

anonymousone wrote:

One thing I can not make sense of is why she would have gotten into a vehicle and where would she expect to go. I believe she did get in a vehicle in front of Butch Atwoods driveway but it had to have been willingly at least at first. On the other hand whoever picked her up had to have seen the accident and either offered to take her back to his/her house or to some location where she could get help. I would like to think that she headed East on 112 but the dog scent trail ended and no other cars saw her with a fair amount of traffic on that road.

I wonder if the backyard (with no explanation for new footprints), was near BHR. Does anyone know?
I'm not so sure I think Maura took a ride. She may have laid in wait and bolted when she saw the chance.
Then again, I still feel strongly that with her desire to disappear coupled with her guy troubles, that she may have wanted to meet up with someone. Those searches on her personal computer may have been a smart thing to do....it would throw everyone off in the event that she was found out before she made up her mind whether or not to return to school. They wouldn't have to live in MA. There could be someone else she knew and trusted that lived in NH, or was staying there at the time. Yesterday the Gkids played in my car. One pull down the snack section in the backseat. I discovered that I could fit through that area and get into the trunk if it were unlocked. Likewise, if I had crawled through into the trunk, I could go right back out that way (into the car).
I've listened to many accounts about how reliable vs unreliable dogs can be and so I wonder.
Someone asked if there was a payphone at the general store. Yes, outside the laundomat and the swiftwater general store. I would think that Maura would lay in wait or stall in some other way and go to call her friend. That's if there was one.

OOps, almost forgot. The backseat. At one time a PI asked everyone (he wasn't from the same camp as the previous or cueent PI's), he asked: if you were to look in the backseat, what would you be looking for, and what might you see.
It's apparent to me now that they may have been referring to that opening to the trunk. As in, was that portion fixed in the "down" position.

Just me--paris wrote:

<quoted text>Likewise, if I had crawled through into the trunk, I could go right back out that way (into the car).

Many trunks are like that. Also most current trunks for a very long time now, have a release so the latch can be opened from inside the trunk. Don't know about Saturn's of the year of Maura's car.

Bill

One more post and I'm out of here. The expense jewelry. What about it, she would have taken it, most agree. But it's not that easy to pawn something. Somebody has to show an ID in most places and that might leave a trail. She might have to part with them sooner or later but may have wanted them to stay safer in her locked car, and go back to Billy if she were to stay gone.
If there were something pressing, a matter of life or death, like blakmail, and she was being lured to NH......this could have been her sharp thinking left behind in the form of a clue.
If this is the right road I'm on, Maura may have pulled in somewhere to find herself too scared to say anything. That doesn't mean someone on her trail would stop her from putting the rag in herself when she came out from getting gas/using the can, etc.
When Butch came along, she could have been frozen in fear about whether to go to him for safety.
I know this can happen because I was probably the last one to see Andrew Koonanan and his lover. They came into my store and bought hats. When Andrew went to the biffy, Mark,(his lover) urgently asked for the phone. I was quick to hand it to him but when he heard the Restroom door open he gave it back so fast I became suspicious. They bought hats, I said have a good time fishing and Mark looked at me and said "I hope so". He was hot and left for dead at Rush Lake.

That man Mark, was shot from behind and Andrew went on to kill Versache, for one.

....he was shot

Oh yeah, and I had an employee who left her family and small child behind. I forget from where now. But she confided in me that she didn't let on where she was going and MN was as good as any place to run away to. She hooked up with a complete stranger and stayed at a cheap motel nearby. After working for me, she went on to be a stripper she said so she could afford the now "drugs" she was hooked on. I even thought at one point she might be Maura but I was told no after sending a snapshot I took with my phone. I remember her being perplexed as to why I suddenly wanted her picture. Spooked even. So I bamed it on the fake ponytail she always wore, that it was natural looking. Her hair was actually cut so short that she may have had someone weave it it.
Oh well, I'm expecting to be thrown elephant food, have a good day everyone.

Just me--paris wrote:

Oh well, I'm expecting to be thrown elephant food, have a good day everyone.

No worries on the elephant food. I found them interesting reading.

Bill

She was abducted without question. There is no way someone gave her a ride with good intentions and happened to not notice all of the news reports or fliers posted. Either it happened at the accident scene or down the road, either way it doesn't really matter where the only question is who did it? I am very curious as to who the police gave polygraph examinations and who they have for suspects. They are calling Maura's disappearance an 'open' case but I can not see why they wouldn't close it unless they have specific leads and likely know who is responsible but haven't been able to show evidence yet. One day we hopefully will know but I think without the police files being released there is no chance of solving this mystery.

anonymousone wrote:

She was abducted without question. There is no way someone gave her a ride with good intentions and happened to not notice all of the news reports or fliers posted. Either it happened at the accident scene or down the road, either way it doesn't really matter where the only question is who did it?

Really. She could not have gone off into the woods? Wow, I wonder how you "know" that?

If she was given a ride. You are aware, that road, handles a great deal of traffic that the people on it are just going through, sometimes only once. A tremendous amount of the traffic that goes through there are visitors to the forest. They may have only been through there the one time, and never gave that person a second thought. Still might not know that she is missing. Might never hear about, ever.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Really. She could not have gone off into the woods? Wow, I wonder how you "know" that?
If she was given a ride. You are aware, that road, handles a great deal of traffic that the people on it are just going through, sometimes only once. A tremendous amount of the traffic that goes through there are visitors to the forest. They may have only been through there the one time, and never gave that person a second thought. Still might not know that she is missing. Might never hear about, ever.
Bill

They searched those woods thoroughly and turned up absolutely nothing. Additionally her remains would have been found by now by someone if that is what happened. Also her scent trail had her leading away from the woods onto the road. Enough said

anonymousone wrote:

<quoted text>
They searched those woods thoroughly and turned up absolutely nothing. Additionally her remains would have been found by now by someone if that is what happened. Also her scent trail had her leading away from the woods onto the road. Enough said

Wow. You apparently missed a whole lot of stuff that was said, way past the part you apparently got to.

You need to do lots more background reading.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
There is a hell of a difference between somebody shoving a cadaver piece under a dogs nose and running a dog on a track and the dog finding it. There is no way for you to even know if the dog even alerted. It's the handler that tells you the dog alerted.
Bill

Yes there is. Each individual dog is trained to alert in one way only. Barking or by taking a roll hanging from the collar are mostly the two common ways for an air scent dog to alert. Of course it´s the handler that can tell when a dog alerts or when it´s on or off trail. I never contradicted that. I do ahve plenty of experience with both ground scent and air scent work. Not cadaver dogs though, since there are no civilian cadaver dogs in Sweden. In Finland for instance, there are, and we have some classes about cadaver dog work in the Swe SAR training.

hannah_b wrote:

<quoted text>
Yes there is. Each individual dog is trained to alert in one way only. Barking or by taking a roll hanging from the collar are mostly the two common ways for an air scent dog to alert. Of course it´s the handler that can tell when a dog alerts or when it´s on or off trail. I never contradicted that. I do ahve plenty of experience with both ground scent and air scent work. Not cadaver dogs though, since there are no civilian cadaver dogs in Sweden. In Finland for instance, there are, and we have some classes about cadaver dog work in the Swe SAR training.

What I should have added is, it is usually way easier for anyone other than the handler to know when an air scent dog is alerting than when a ground scent tracking dog is on or off trail. With some experience it is more often than not possible to see if the dog is working or not, as in following or trying to find a trail vs going off trail to follow a deer trail or such.

Ok, one more time... The last sentence of my previuos post was in regards to ground scent dogs. And fwiw, I´m actually mostly agreeing with WTH. Oh well, just throw me a peanut, guess I deserve it!

Thank you very much for the peanuts. Love ´em!

Frostman wrote:

<quoted text>
Did you actually have a face-to-face conversation with Mr. Murray and ask him why he might have been on your property in the first place? I guess you were able to halt you dog at the time or did he stop on his own? Was he agitated by humans in his territory or was he protecting his home from the search dogs? It sounds as if you were attempting to have a chat with Mr. Murray and he simply got into his car and drove off. Did he not ask you about any possible information that you might have heard or seen regarding the disappearance of his daughter?

As I said, I was not there, my husband was. No there was no chat---my husband tried to ask questions but aparently the 110 lb pitbull was enough for them to take cover maybe? We have an electric fence so the dog didn't go beyond it. There were no search dogs; just people. He was agitated because of the movement in the yard of strangers---he's much more sensitive up there than here because of the abundant scents that are in the area that are not in his daily repertoire of smells.