Maura Murray

JWB wrote:

citigirl, we know you dislike Renner and you posts lean that way but are you saying that you think beagles videos are okie dokie?You are stuck between saying Renner is right and beagle is wrong.

I never commented in the past about the videos.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Iam family. My heart sank when I saw this video. But I still dont think its right to put peoples personal info out on a public forum.

I completely agree. It is simply wrong. Now with that info, any psycho has enough information to easily find Beagle's address, phone number, etc. I do not condone what Beagle has done, but Renner was wrong to do this. If he felt threatened by Beagle, he should have contacted the police and should share the info with MM's family, but outing him in this way is wrong.

JWB wrote:

Citi got outed by renner of course she hates him and Wowzer agrees- Sorry not playing sides just calling the cards as i see them and i call Bullshit.

JWB nowhere have I stated I dislike or hate Renner. I have never met the man to make a judgement like this. I have stated I disagree with the book and have stated some of the info is incorrect. Maybe you should pay more attention to your cards because you are reading them wrong.

dll wrote:

<quoted text>
Thanks Orko, these are better. Still doesnt look like it hit a tree IMHO.
I've watched the WMUR video several times in conjuction with the accident diagram by CS. The WMUR video cannot see any tracks in the snow left by a vehicle making contact. So which tree(s) did she supposedly hit?

The way I understand it is that Maura did a fast spin out and landed in the ditch. Before she moved her car, she was ass end against the trees, or very close to them when the W's looked out and saw the car. She was FACING them. I don't think she could hit a tree and spinout at the same time down in the ditch with ALL THAT SNOW>. Do you see what I mean?
She had to have hit something first,(perhaps that snowbank she sheared off), and then spiraled out of control.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Iam family. My heart sank when I saw this video. But I still dont think its right to put peoples personal info out on a public forum.

citi - I respect the reasonable and intelligent position you've taken on this issue.

It makes sense that any legal implications for Beagle's actions are best dealt with by authorities.

In general, not only is it fundamentally unfair and unkind to reveal the identity of anyone who chooses to write anonymously online, but, as in this instance with Beagle, it seems dangerous, careless and counterproductive to further incite his response or retaliation by posting his name and DOB.

Beagle's presence with multiple monikers and way-out-there theories have been well tolerated over many years. I am uncertain what might have pushed him over the line to create those videos, but I trust his pushing the limits was an expression of frustration and poor judgment; in any event, it was wrong by any standard, and difficult to excuse.

Advocator wrote:

<quoted text>
Amy, I quite agree. And I think it's reprehensible to say he was charged with something because that "suggests" that he was guilty without clarifying.
Initially I was supportive of Renner's quest to find out what had happened to Maura. I felt that as a journalist, he was in a good position to investigate, and in fact he has turned up some interesting points and cleared up a few things. But I don't agree with his penchant for putting names out in public and permitting or creating inferences that are not proven and/or can't be proven.

Thank you for understanding where I'm coming from.

I thought this was interesting even though it isn't directly about Maura. This article shows the extent that S&R goes to when a person calls for help.
http://www.unionleader.com/article/20120930/N...

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
citi - I respect the reasonable and intelligent position you've taken on this issue.
It makes sense that any legal implications for Beagle's actions are best dealt with by authorities.
In general, not only is it fundamentally unfair and unkind to reveal the identity of anyone who chooses to write anonymously online, but, as in this instance with Beagle, it seems dangerous, careless and counterproductive to further incite his response or retaliation by posting his name and DOB.
Beagle's presence with multiple monikers and way-out-there theories have been well tolerated over many years. I am uncertain what might have pushed him over the line to create those videos, but I trust his pushing the limits was an expression of frustration and poor judgment; in any event, it was wrong by any standard, and difficult to excuse.

Good to see you back snowy. Hope you've had a good summer.

In Renner's defense, it is equally appalling for someone to take advantage of manipulating a video of Renner's 4 year old son, as he has claimed to have happened; none of this is productive.

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
Good to see you back snowy. Hope you've had a good summer.

Thanks, Wowzer. Hope all is well.

JWB wrote:

Ok wowzer- smart play on my word hate. I should have used a different word maybe dislike. Any how if you want to back up this lame brain them be my guest. I think this dude needs help and I wish him the best.
The name thing:
Talking Beagle here
If he doesn't want the attention that stop with the personal attacks . Pretty simple stuff right? the problem is that beagle relishes and loves the attention and is getting what he wants and is asking for.

Wowzer has never backed up this poster. It is Renner that is relishing on the attention. It is Renner who keeps bringing up his name.

Snowy wrote:

In Renner's defense, it is equally appalling for someone to take advantage of manipulating a video of Renner's 4 year old son, as he has claimed to have happened; none of this is productive.

Just my opinion. But I would think that Renner should have contacted LE concerning this issue and not write it on a blog. His number one priority should be the safety of his child if he felt his child was in harms way.

citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>Just my opinion. But I would think that Renner should have contacted LE concerning this issue and not write it on a blog. His number one priority should be the safety of his child if he felt his child was in harms way.

I agree. It is beyond a social issue/disagreement or about the integrity of posters when your child is targeted; the proper recourse is to contact authorities, IMO.

Didn't renner say that he did contact authorities about the video referencing his son?

Unfortunately there isn't very much that the authorities can do in this situation, I don't believe the video contained any sort of direct threat at renner or his son, I'm sure we would've heard about it if it did.
Just making a video isn't illegal, even if it contains someone else's child, maybe it should be but it's not. It's in extremely poor taste and just the wrong thing to do but legal nonetheless.

Im sure renner contacted the authorities but what can they really do? Also, which authorities should he contact Ohio? Mass? NH?

Unless the video contained a threat, or was being used for commercial purposes I don't see that the authorities could even do about it.
Maybe renner's only recourse is to post about it?

Also, while I do think it's wrong to post someone's real name is it really that big of a deal? The media always uses peoples real names, how is it any different? Except for the media has a much larger viewer base than some obscure blog about MM, way larger. Unless there is some law against the media using people's real names I don't see how posting it on a blog or topix is really a big deal.Honestly I always thought it was strange those videos weren't a bigger deal than they were, there was a couple articles in newspapers and a couple news reports. Think about the Bretton woods ski pass video, that was a pretty clear attempt at trying to make people think that whoever posted that video was Maura's killer. I thought it was gonna be bigger news than it was, I bet beagle did too.. I was thinking nancy grace or someone of the like was going to cover those videos, and If she did you could be damn sure that her producers would've figured out beagle's name and said it on tv.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
citi - I respect the reasonable and intelligent position you've taken on this issue.
It makes sense that any legal implications for Beagle's actions are best dealt with by authorities.
In general, not only is it fundamentally unfair and unkind to reveal the identity of anyone who chooses to write anonymously online, but, as in this instance with Beagle, it seems dangerous, careless and counterproductive to further incite his response or retaliation by posting his name and DOB.
Beagle's presence with multiple monikers and way-out-there theories have been well tolerated over many years. I am uncertain what might have pushed him over the line to create those videos, but I trust his pushing the limits was an expression of frustration and poor judgment; in any event, it was wrong by any standard, and difficult to excuse.

Well-put, Snowy. I concur.

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

Didn't renner say that he did contact authorities about the video referencing his son?
Unfortunately there isn't very much that the authorities can do in this situation, I don't believe the video contained any sort of direct threat at renner or his son, I'm sure we would've heard about it if it did.
Just making a video isn't illegal, even if it contains someone else's child, maybe it should be but it's not. It's in extremely poor taste and just the wrong thing to do but legal nonetheless.
Im sure renner contacted the authorities but what can they really do? Also, which authorities should he contact Ohio? Mass? NH?
Unless the video contained a threat, or was being used for commercial purposes I don't see that the authorities could even do about it.
Maybe renner's only recourse is to post about it?
Also, while I do think it's wrong to post someone's real name is it really that big of a deal? The media always uses peoples real names, how is it any different? Except for the media has a much larger viewer base than some obscure blog about MM, way larger. Unless there is some law against the media using people's real names I don't see how posting it on a blog or topix is really a big deal.Honestly I always thought it was strange those videos weren't a bigger deal than they were, there was a couple articles in newspapers and a couple news reports. Think about the Bretton woods ski pass video, that was a pretty clear attempt at trying to make people think that whoever posted that video was Maura's killer. I thought it was gonna be bigger news than it was, I bet beagle did too.. I was thinking nancy grace or someone of the like was going to cover those videos, and If she did you could be damn sure that her producers would've figured out beagle's name and said it on tv.

Jenkins wrote:***Also, while I do think it's wrong to post someone's real name is it really that big of a deal?***
I think we would all be surprised if we knew how many and the type of people that read and post on this forum.
When it was mentioned here on THIS forum the sbd's name and where he had moved to in Florida a very scary poster with obvious mental problems stated he was going to go to his house and question him. Many of us feared for the sbd.
When the videos came out a fairly new poster on this forum wanted to come up and look for Beagle. Bodily harm was mentioned along with actual torture of sticking bamboo splinters under his nails.
There were a couple of posters here that agreed with him and thought that was appropriate if I remember correctly. Do you remember this Jenkins?
So my answer would be yes, I think it is a very big deal.

There was an EMS call to bungs road prior to the Saturn being stuck in a ditch also RO daughter sadly died in October of 2004 .Smiths parents lived on bungs road maybe causing a left turn instead of a right.all this is available online so zip it.4173

Page 3 Grafton County Dispatch....Bath, NH

10:03PM Bunga Road...Lifeline call for EMS
Transcript has nothing to do with this topic.

(after Maura's accident)

BobJenkins-OG wrote:

... Also, while I do think it's wrong to post someone's real name is it really that big of a deal? The media always uses peoples real names, how is it any different? Except for the media has a much larger viewer base than some obscure blog about MM, way larger. Unless there is some law against the media using people's real names I don't see how posting it on a blog or topix is really a big deal.

Tell you what ... put your money where your mouth is and post your real name and birth date on here. Go ahead. Since you don't think it is "that big of a deal", you shouldn't have any problem doing so, right?

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
Jenkins wrote:***Also, while I do think it's wrong to post someone's real name is it really that big of a deal?***
I think we would all be surprised if we knew how many and the type of people that read and post on this forum.
When it was mentioned here on THIS forum the sbd's name and where he had moved to in Florida a very scary poster with obvious mental problems stated he was going to go to his house and question him. Many of us feared for the sbd.
When the videos came out a fairly new poster on this forum wanted to come up and look for Beagle. Bodily harm was mentioned along with actual torture of sticking bamboo splinters under his nails.
There were a couple of posters here that agreed with him and thought that was appropriate if I remember correctly. Do you remember this Jenkins?
So my answer would be yes, I think it is a very big deal.

Your recollection is spot on, and I don't think you are 'mean' or 'incendiary' to accurately relate those facts.
I also didn't know this was a "chat room" until Renner told us so. Live and learn. I thought it was just "Topix".