Maura Murray

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“"Dancing with wolves"”

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#27937
Dec 3, 2012
 

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hannah_b wrote:
<quoted text>
I believe he may have seen her entering a vehicle. There has been a lot of talk on the forums about what SBD could or could not see from where he was sitting in his bus filling out paperwork. I think most agreed that he should have had a virtually unobstructed view all the way to the Saturn. Clearly, since his call is evidentiary, the other witness´ not, he did see something.
Umm his view would not have been unobstructed. There was a small patch of woods next to his house which would have made it difficult to see the accident scene. And it was dark out with no streetlight to see the car.
Did any that agreed he should have had a virtually unobstructed view ever go to that area or stand in his driveway to see?
hannah_b

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#27938
Dec 3, 2012
 

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Wowzer the real one wrote:
<quoted text>
Umm his view would not have been unobstructed. There was a small patch of woods next to his house which would have made it difficult to see the accident scene. And it was dark out with no streetlight to see the car.
Did any that agreed he should have had a virtually unobstructed view ever go to that area or stand in his driveway to see?
I have no idea, Wowzer. In any case he should have been able to see the spot where the scent trail ended, which is where Maura likely entered a vehicle, right?
hannah_b

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#27939
Dec 3, 2012
 

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Wowzer the real one wrote:
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Hannah where are you getting the information that the log info was not released? Could you please provide a link because I just read in the dispatch log what was said about the accident and what SBD's wife said when their house was called back.
What is it that was deemed evidentiary and not released?
The Hanover dispatch log that was not released with the others b/c it was "evidentiary. What exactly was evidentiary I don´t know, it may of course have been a different call altogether, but something in it was evidentiary. You´ll have to google it, but there are news articles containing this information.

“"Dancing with wolves"”

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#27940
Dec 3, 2012
 

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hannah_b wrote:
<quoted text>
I have no idea, Wowzer. In any case he should have been able to see the spot where the scent trail ended, which is where Maura likely entered a vehicle, right?
I doubt he would have been able to see anyone walking in the dark but headlights and brakelights would have been noticed only if it was directly across from his driveway. Any further and his large garage where antiques were sold would have been blocking the view.

Since: Mar 12

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#27941
Dec 3, 2012
 

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citigirl wrote:
<quoted text>why was he in an Alaskin prison?
For the abduction&killing of a young girl Samantha Koenig..there is a map of his movements that actually pinpoint Maura&Brianna.
The FBI released a PDF document today where it was mentioned hhe burned evidence in The white mountains Ntl Forest..Also,he admitted to killing an essex Vt. couple..Its been confirmed he was a serial killer.
There is a VERY active Facebook page titled:Have you ever met Israel Keyes?A possible serial killer.
whatif

Edmond, OK

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#27942
Dec 4, 2012
 
a couple things about keyes stand out to me:

"He robbed banks, and used the money he made as a general contractor, to pay for his excursions, the FBI said."

wasn't the a-frame house under construction at the time of maura's disappearance, and also where cadaver dogs hit on something in a closet? could keyes have been a general contractor on part of the construction, making him familiar with the area even if he still wasn't on the job there?

"The FBI said that Keyes, 34, would fly to a city, rent a car and drive hundreds if not thousands of miles away -- sometimes to kill... Keyes looked for victims in remote locations: parks, campgrounds, trail heads, cemeteries and boating areas."

this kind of speaks for itself in regards to the location where maura was last seen.

what if maura was abducted by keyes in a truly random attack that was simply because, at some point between amherst and the weathered barn, their paths crossed by chance? what if keyes had been a contractor in the area and the sbd recognized him or his vehicle that night? what if sbd was afraid to say what he knew because keyes, though not local, might have been known as an "odd duck" to the locals and they were wary of him?

the above quotes came from this article:
http://www.adn.com/2012/12/03/2712275/suspect...

Since: Apr 12

Brooklyn, NY

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#27943
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Hey FindMaura- Which map are you talking about and how does it pinpoint Maura and Bri? The only map I'm seeing is the one on facebook and I don't see anything about them on that map.

Also on the FB page it has his travel dates and it looks like he was only on the east coast during october of '04 so I think that pretty much rules him out on Maura and Bri, unless you have some different info than I'm seeing.

It is just so hard to believe that people like this actually exist in the world. I just lef some sort of note when this coward hung himself giving all the info about his crimes so at least the families can have closure. Reading that aticle from the alaskan paper it sounds like he told nvestigators about his crime because it lists the states that he killed people. Hopefully he told them about all of his crimes. Says they think he robbed a bank down south? wth?

Since: Nov 08

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#27944
Dec 4, 2012
 

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OKAYt wrote:
<quoted text>i do love to check in. like Bill, when you step back after adding two cents here and there, the forum provides a few chuckles. that's entertainment.:)
No higher payback on a two cent investment that I can find, anywhere. 8-)

Bill

Since: Feb 12

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#27945
Dec 4, 2012
 

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BobJenkins-OG wrote:
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I agree completely, the sbd knew a lot more than he was saying IMO. That's an interesting point that you make regarding his 911 call not being released due to its evidentiary nature. Damn I wonder what was said on that call that made them feel the call was evidentiary in nature.
To me the question isn't so much whether and knew more than he told the media, it is more what he told to LE. I think sbd saw something that night and he was scared to say it. I think this explains the lies to the media. Perhaps he didn't want the potential perp to know that he knew?
Just for the sake of argument let's say he knew who killed her. After a few weeks, which is when he started talkin to the media maybe he realized that LE didn't have anything on the perp except what he said. That could be a scary proposition to know that there's a killer out there who knows who you are and where your family lived? If that's not a reason to lie to the media and say you didnt see anything then IDK what is, that could be a damn good reason actually. If the person is crazy enough to kill Maura then obviously this person might be crazy enough to kill him and his wife too. That probably wouldn't happen but I could see him Being afraid of it, anybody probably would, that's a scary propostion. I wonder if he told LE what he knew or if he kept quiet to them as well.
It is rather intesting that his call to 911, I believe his wife actually made the call, was kept secret while the Westman's call was made public, what was said on that call that made LE feel that there was evidence on the call?
I seriously doubt he knew this person killed her, witnessed it or anything like that but I'm sure he could've put two and two together. Who wants to be the wtness who saw a young girl get abducted by some nut?
I see you are modifying your SIM COLD CASE game. You are posting this with knowledge that MM was missing for 9 years. If SBD saw her get into a car - what would make him think immediate "abduction". In your older SIM COLD CASE games you have mentioned how people crash and leave the cars at the side of the road and get a ride. "This is common practice." What would make SBD who sees MM get into a car by her own power think "abduction." I would think if he saw her get into a car he would tell LE that they don't need to search for her because she is in a car.

Before you answer this post - please know that this games modifiers have been set where there have been no witnesses who heard any screams or any evidence of MM being forced into a car.
Ridiculous

Manchester, NH

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#27946
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Bill, from Bob's previous post; " says they think he robbed a bank down south? wth? "
Clearly Bob is perturbed that Mr. Keyes would have the audacity to rob a southern bank and would like some input from you, wth. What say you to this alarming accusation that a suspected Serial Killer would go so far past the social acceptable norms of civilized behavior and and make an unauthorized withdrawal from a southern bank?
Emmet, being from the south, or at least being one who lives there now, can you tell us what this has done to the banking Industry in general? Do you feel that Mister Keyes untimely departure will leave the industry with more questions than answers? If in fact this Withdrawal was committed,do you believe the industry can recover?
Lastly, if mister Keyes left a detailed note explaining this withdrawal, do you think it will provide the southern banking community with the closure it deserves?


Since: Nov 08

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#27947
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Lighthouse 101 wrote:
<quoted text>
I see you are modifying your SIM COLD CASE game. You are posting this with knowledge that MM was missing for 9 years. If SBD saw her get into a car - what would make him think immediate "abduction". In your older SIM COLD CASE games you have mentioned how people crash and leave the cars at the side of the road and get a ride. "This is common practice." What would make SBD who sees MM get into a car by her own power think "abduction." I would think if he saw her get into a car he would tell LE that they don't need to search for her because she is in a car.
Before you answer this post - please know that this games modifiers have been set where there have been no witnesses who heard any screams or any evidence of MM being forced into a car.
Correct. There is nothing to indicate that if she was picked up, that person was responsible for anything. She could have been dropped off to be picked up yet again in another location, or she could have gone along on her merry way. There is still nothing to indicate what actually happened to her after she left the car. Of her own free will. But that windmill keeps chugging. He will have this solved in no time. No matter how much "information" he has to make up to do it.

Bill

Since: Feb 12

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#27948
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Ridiculous wrote:
Bill, from Bob's previous post; " says they think he robbed a bank down south? wth? "
Clearly Bob is perturbed that Mr. Keyes would have the audacity to rob a southern bank and would like some input from you, wth. What say you to this alarming accusation that a suspected Serial Killer would go so far past the social acceptable norms of civilized behavior and and make an unauthorized withdrawal from a southern bank?
Emmet, being from the south, or at least being one who lives there now, can you tell us what this has done to the banking Industry in general? Do you feel that Mister Keyes untimely departure will leave the industry with more questions than answers? If in fact this Withdrawal was committed,do you believe the industry can recover?
Lastly, if mister Keyes left a detailed note explaining this withdrawal, do you think it will provide the southern banking community with the closure it deserves?
I think when Bobfather says "wth" I think he means it in anger. His Computer SIMULATION GAMES does not allow you to add a bank robbery.

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#27949
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Ridiculous wrote:
Bill, from Bob's previous post; " says they think he robbed a bank down south? wth? "
Clearly Bob is perturbed that Mr. Keyes would have the audacity to rob a southern bank and would like some input from you, wth. What say you to this alarming accusation that a suspected Serial Killer would go so far past the social acceptable norms of civilized behavior and and make an unauthorized withdrawal from a southern bank?
Emmet, being from the south, or at least being one who lives there now, can you tell us what this has done to the banking Industry in general? Do you feel that Mister Keyes untimely departure will leave the industry with more questions than answers? If in fact this Withdrawal was committed,do you believe the industry can recover?
Lastly, if mister Keyes left a detailed note explaining this withdrawal, do you think it will provide the southern banking community with the closure it deserves?
It appear that POS confessed to other killings. If that is the case, why wouldn't he confess to all of them? Did he? Him not wanting to confess about a murder in a state with the death penalty might make sense but the article states that he had already confessed to four killings in Washington state. A death penalty state so why would he stop there? Why not tell them about all his killings? Hopefully the investigators will find out what they need.

Bill
hannah_b

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#27950
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Wowzer the real one wrote:
<quoted text>
Hannah where are you getting the information that the log info was not released? Could you please provide a link because I just read in the dispatch log what was said about the accident and what SBD's wife said when their house was called back.
What is it that was deemed evidentiary and not released?
Here´s an older post on the subject of the Hanover dispatch log:

Mcsmom on topix, Oct 20, 2010:

"Peri wrote to Stelzin, and she recieved a letter from his office.

Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:16 am Post subject: Strelzin's letter

Just received word from Strelzin, that the Hanover logs have not been released with the others because they are evidentiary, these are not his exact words, but these logs will not be forthcoming, they have been exempt from freedom of information."
hannah_b

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#27951
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Ridiculous wrote:
Bill, from Bob's previous post; " says they think he robbed a bank down south? wth? "
Clearly Bob is perturbed that Mr. Keyes would have the audacity to rob a southern bank and would like some input from you, wth. What say you to this alarming accusation that a suspected Serial Killer would go so far past the social acceptable norms of civilized behavior and and make an unauthorized withdrawal from a southern bank?
Emmet, being from the south, or at least being one who lives there now, can you tell us what this has done to the banking Industry in general? Do you feel that Mister Keyes untimely departure will leave the industry with more questions than answers? If in fact this Withdrawal was committed,do you believe the industry can recover?
Lastly, if mister Keyes left a detailed note explaining this withdrawal, do you think it will provide the southern banking community with the closure it deserves?
Bank robbery = unauthorized withdrawal, omg that´s hilarious!
hannah_b

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#27952
Dec 4, 2012
 

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whatif wrote:
a couple things about keyes stand out to me:
"He robbed banks, and used the money he made as a general contractor, to pay for his excursions, the FBI said."
wasn't the a-frame house under construction at the time of maura's disappearance, and also where cadaver dogs hit on something in a closet? could keyes have been a general contractor on part of the construction, making him familiar with the area even if he still wasn't on the job there?
"The FBI said that Keyes, 34, would fly to a city, rent a car and drive hundreds if not thousands of miles away -- sometimes to kill... Keyes looked for victims in remote locations: parks, campgrounds, trail heads, cemeteries and boating areas."
this kind of speaks for itself in regards to the location where maura was last seen.
what if maura was abducted by keyes in a truly random attack that was simply because, at some point between amherst and the weathered barn, their paths crossed by chance? what if keyes had been a contractor in the area and the sbd recognized him or his vehicle that night? what if sbd was afraid to say what he knew because keyes, though not local, might have been known as an "odd duck" to the locals and they were wary of him?
the above quotes came from this article:
http://www.adn.com/2012/12/03/2712275/suspect...
The A-frame was not under construction at the time. It was inhabited by a previously named man and his girlfriend. CW´s house was under construction at the time.

Since: Feb 12

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#27953
Dec 4, 2012
 

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Shack wrote:
Ever since the ending of the families forum, there has been seemingly the blaming of the victim/and her family.
Yes, Maura is a victim....she is not here to defend.
If MM turns out to be alive and well somewhere in another state. Would we then be the victims, or would we be the suckers?
mcsmom

Vernon Rockville, CT

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#27954
Dec 4, 2012
 

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hannah_b wrote:
<quoted text>
The A-frame was not under construction at the time. It was inhabited by a previously named man and his girlfriend. CW´s house was under construction at the time.
I might be wrong about this, but I think some other houses in the area of the A frame were under construction at the time.
mcsmom

Vernon Rockville, CT

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#27955
Dec 4, 2012
 

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I recall a prosecuting attorney turned his head sideways to the jury, and asked them if his eyes were open or closed, all of them said open because they could see the obvious. He turned his head to face them, and his other eye was closed.

This is how I perceive Maura's case. It not as obvious as things appear.
hannah_b

Sweden

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#27956
Dec 4, 2012
 
Lighthouse 101 wrote:
<quoted text>
If MM turns out to be alive and well somewhere in another state. Would we then be the victims, or would we be the suckers?
Victims of our own foolishness, maybe. We´re all suckers just by being here.

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