Maura Murray

The trees that the saturn supposedly hit are the much smaller (about 4" to 7") balsam trees down the road to the east. These trees are located in the front of Marrottes property at the end of his lawn and next to the edge of Rte 112.

The couple branches that were broken on this tree are not responsible for the damage to the saturn.

Remember no evidence of the vehicle hitting a tree (no bark or pieces of the tree), no evidence of a animal interaction.

Something else caused the damage to the saturn.

WTH-the-original wrote:

Typically, and this is difficult to do because it depends so much on how it being deployed and IN PARTICULAR the terrain, height, speed, WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING FOR, the contrast and size of the object, etc. But typically, helicopters being used in a desert environment are 53-78% effective in finding bodies. They would likely be around 20% effective in the terrain where Maura might have been found and that is with a spotter, not just the pilot and that is looking for a body, certainly not footprints. This would likely drop to probably 5% or less if the helicopter was used between 10am and 1pm because of the high angle of the light source if the sun was even out. Diffuse lighting (as in a cloudy day) makes it even harder to see prints no matter what the time.
Bill

I can & will attest to these statements to be very true.. As former Military & also help with National Guard efforts in marijuana sweeps yearly since i've been back, a spotter is always needed in terrains like that.. One year we found over 500 marijuana plants on the Blue Ridge Mountains & tbh they were VERY hard to spot!!! It took us 3 sweeps of the area (acting on a tip) to find this small jungle they had.. We find many every year but the rougher the terrain, the harder it is for us to find them.. Even when using thermal to detect extra heat that is put off, its still not as easy as one thinks..

Is it possible that MM bumped another vehicle (Red Truck maybe?) at a rest-stop/gas bar and that the driver was pizzed and followed her down 112?

If Red Truck was a friendly party following MM in tandem, why wouldn’t the driver have asked RO if she’d seen a Black Saturn being driven by a young lady?

Tang Zoi wrote:

Remember no evidence of the vehicle hitting a tree (no bark or pieces of the tree)...

Of course other than the signed report of the officer you mean? Who was actually on the scene. And saw the evidence. AND WROTE IT DOWN IN HIS REPORT, along with diagrams. And I can generate that same type of damage to a similar design with a point pressure. So short answer what you are saying is wrong, in its parts, and its whole.

Where have I heard all this before???

What about your ironclad evidence relating to the red truck? We are still waiting. I am certain it is as solid as the evidence just presented. Enlighten us. I would hate for people to think you are full of crap.

Bill

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Of course other than the signed report of the officer you mean? Who was actually on the scene. And saw the evidence. AND WROTE IT DOWN IN HIS REPORT, along with diagrams. And I can generate that same type of damage to a similar design with a point pressure. So short answer what you are saying is wrong, in its parts, and its whole.
Where have I heard all this before???
What about your ironclad evidence relating to the red truck? We are still waiting. I am certain it is as solid as the evidence just presented. Enlighten us. I would hate for people to think you are full of crap.
Bill

NO...You are wrong.

And when the crap (as you call it) hits the fan, have a feeling You are going to be the first one hit.

Have You ever owned a red truck? They are very noticable.

Emmett Dove wrote:

<quoted text>
I can & will attest to these statements to be very true.. As former Military & also help with National Guard efforts in marijuana sweeps yearly since i've been back, a spotter is always needed in terrains like that.. One year we found over 500 marijuana plants on the Blue Ridge Mountains & tbh they were VERY hard to spot!!! It took us 3 sweeps of the area (acting on a tip) to find this small jungle they had.. We find many every year but the rougher the terrain, the harder it is for us to find them.. Even when using thermal to detect extra heat that is put off, its still not as easy as one thinks..

Thanks Emmett. I was air Cav for a while, then most of my career in the infantry as a ground scout. I didn't do that many air-mobile operations but the ones I did, even flying at treetop, low and slow, you never knew what you were going to discover, once on the ground. People think it's like using Google earth to zoom in and see whatever you want to see. They don't understand how different the real thing is. Imagine if everything you are looking at is flat white, the ground, the prints, everything. It is hard enough to distinguish the difference when standing over them inches above them. Someone who actually has done this before. Now try doing it at 10 to 20 mph at 150 feet. There are some here who just don't get it. One of the reasons most trackers want to track at night is because that gives you the most control of the light source. The way tracks are seen is because the light is at a low angle to throw shadows from the ridges of the shoe print. Depending on what Maura was wearing, there could have been very little ridge detail to work from. Shooting over them at 10mph wouldn't give me great confidence that they would be seen. A 1500lb moose tromping through the area, might make some decent prints the size of frying pans and right to the ground. You might spot those. But how many things were missed is the real question and more to the point.

Bill

Tang Zoi wrote:

<quoted text>
NO...You are wrong.
And when the crap (as you call it) hits the fan, have a feeling You are going to be the first one hit.
Have You ever owned a red truck? They are very noticable.

Uh oh. Why would I be hit? You tell me that the truck is the answer. Tell us why? So your scenario runs like this. Maura bumped this big, bad, red truck with her tiny weeny car. And the big bad truck driver is so irate that he chases Maura down and somehow traps her at the corner. And is so out of his mind with rage (with Maura for damaging her vehicle, the truck nary a scratch) that he does what? With no one hearing or seeing anything. And the other part is how did SBD get there BEFORE the red truck?

Oh, and so I don't keep you hanging. Sorry, never have owned a red truck. Had a brilliant blue Ford F-150 once though. Know lots of firefighters who own red trucks though. Seems to be a "thing" with a lot of them. Does that help?

Bill

Wowzer the real one wrote:

<quoted text>
Were you here when he threatened to throw eggrolls at me if he saw me in a restaurant.That was a hoot.
Since he's never seen me I prayed he wasn't going to the few Chinese restaurants around here and throwing eggrolls at the noggins of every woman he thought might be me. I listened to the scanner for days for anyone reporting an eggroll assault.:)

A question, if I may. From your experience and knowledge of the area, do a lot of people own scanners there? Ty in advance.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Uh oh. Why would I be hit? You tell me that the truck is the answer. Tell us why? So your scenario runs like this. Maura bumped this big, bad, red truck with her tiny weeny car. And the big bad truck driver is so irate that he chases Maura down and somehow traps her at the corner. And is so out of his mind with rage (with Maura for damaging her vehicle, the truck nary a scratch) that he does what? With no one hearing or seeing anything. And the other part is how did SBD get there BEFORE the red truck?
Oh, and so I don't keep you hanging. Sorry, never have owned a red truck. Had a brilliant blue Ford F-150 once though. Know lots of firefighters who own red trucks though. Seems to be a "thing" with a lot of them. Does that help?
Bill

Never said Maura hit the red truck. That was someone else.

Tang Zoi wrote:

<quoted text>
Never said Maura hit the red truck. That was someone else.

So meaning that you still haven't told us how this scenario unfolds. We are all still waiting.

OWWWWWWWWWWWWW the buildup is killing me. I can't wait. Oh god, please tell me that it was the lookalike. Please!!!!!!!!!! Oh I am getting so excited. We finally will have the answer. Can you feel it everyone?

Bill

MM seems to have routinely put herself in bad positions. Not uncommon for her age. I have friends that went through phases like her, but not nearly as unlucky as she was.

would she be able to stay out of trouble in a new life? What would her characteristics be in this new life, supposing she alive.

Maybe finding her would be easier if there were plausible ideas about where she might be working, lifestyle, etc. Possible pictures of her floating on the web for us to find.

Perhaps she is doing the same kind of petty crimes, wherever she is now, and there is a mugshot of her as an assumed identity in Canada or an Inuit village.

Perhaps the absence of her being in trouble is sign she may not be with us.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
So meaning that you still haven't told us how this scenario unfolds. We are all still waiting.
OWWWWWWWWWWWWW the buildup is killing me. I can't wait. Oh god, please tell me that it was the lookalike. Please!!!!!!!!!! Oh I am getting so excited. We finally will have the answer. Can you feel it everyone?
Bill

Bill, give him a break. He's still trying to formulate a theory, based on (sheep)posts on Topix. That's how most PI's investigate, right? RIGHT?

Habs wrote:

<quoted text>
A question, if I may. From your experience and knowledge of the area, do a lot of people own scanners there? Ty in advance.

while you didn't ask me, and trust Wowzer will reply, it's a good question for Radio Shack. they sell them. perhaps they can share the distribution of their sales by region or location. otherwise, the answer is anecdotal.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Uh oh. Why would I be hit? You tell me that the truck is the answer. Tell us why? So your scenario runs like this. Maura bumped this big, bad, red truck with her tiny weeny car. And the big bad truck driver is so irate that he chases Maura down and somehow traps her at the corner. And is so out of his mind with rage (with Maura for damaging her vehicle, the truck nary a scratch) that he does what? With no one hearing or seeing anything. And the other part is how did SBD get there BEFORE the red truck?
Oh, and so I don't keep you hanging. Sorry, never have owned a red truck. Had a brilliant blue Ford F-150 once though. Know lots of firefighters who own red trucks though. Seems to be a "thing" with a lot of them. Does that help?
Bill

must be witch hunting season again. tag...you're it!!
for chrissakes, almost 9 years later and robo-sleuth is still fixated on red, rag and tree.
he throws BS against a canvas and calls himself an artist.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
while you didn't ask me, and trust Wowzer will reply, it's a good question for Radio Shack. they sell them. perhaps they can share the distribution of their sales by region or location. otherwise, the answer is anecdotal.

Ty for your reply snowy. Do you own a scanner? I remember my grandfather owned one many, many years ago but I haven't been around one since. I suspect they may be more popular in rural areas.

Tang Zoi wrote:

<quoted text>
Maura was dropped @ the motel at approx. 3 am and sat in the lobby sobbing and crying until Fred got up @ around 5:30 or 6 am.
She DID NOT STAY IN THE ROOM WITH HIM.

Can we discuss this? Columbo got a free pass on this. Fred claims he woke at 10 am.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
must be witch hunting season again. tag...you're it!!
for chrissakes, almost 9 years later and robo-sleuth is still fixated on red, rag and tree.
he throws BS against a canvas and calls himself an artist.

Even an ugly pic is worth something to somebody.

Pierre

Tang Zoi wrote:

The trees that the saturn supposedly hit are the much smaller (about 4" to 7") balsam trees down the road to the east. These trees are located in the front of Marrottes property at the end of his lawn and next to the edge of Rte 112.
The couple branches that were broken on this tree are not responsible for the damage to the saturn.
Remember no evidence of the vehicle hitting a tree (no bark or pieces of the tree), no evidence of a animal interaction.
Something else caused the damage to the saturn.

You've said this more thn once through the years but yet you haven't provided one bit of evidence that the vehicle did NOT hit the trees. Tailgates, high bumpers, trail hitches etc have all been mentioned but yet there is no proof that any of those things damaged the car. If there wasn't any bark or pieces of the tree on the car isn't it possible that when the tow truck dragged it out through the snow bank (damaged passengers side was into or against the bank) or drove it to the garageanything on it might have blown off?
I haven't heard anyone say that there was paint from another vehicle or signs of metal found on the car.
You've been saying for years that something else caused the damage. Where's the proof? Real proof.Honest to goodness proof that can't be disputed. Show us.

All we need now is for FrmLE to show up. Then the real party starts.

WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
So meaning that you still haven't told us how this scenario unfolds. We are all still waiting.
OWWWWWWWWWWWWW the buildup is killing me. I can't wait. Oh god, please tell me that it was the lookalike. Please!!!!!!!!!! Oh I am getting so excited. We finally will have the answer. Can you feel it everyone?
Bill

You're getting a little too excited, Bill. Now calm down and fess up or I'll have to stage an intervention lest I be complicit in another high topix crime. ;-) P.S. if you turn out to be the lookalike I'm gonna be very disappointed in you. Bad bad Bill, very bad.