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Since: Nov 08
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rozShoem wrote: <quoted text>
Okay, Bill. Let's cut with the BS. MM's father had questions regarding the ST....the ST who "dropped by" the accident that evening. In reading old postings, others had questions too... was he (ST) dispatched, had he overheard the dispatch, was he on duty, had he just happened by....why he did not respond to dispatcher for 2 hours, etc. Was HE interviewed? Many good questions. I don't know if he was interviewed. I'll point out that there is only one road in that area that directly goes anywhere and if I remember correctly he lived nearby. And these may be all questions that may have been asked and answered, I don't know. As far as him not responding to dispatch, you really need to know the area. Radio reception is the bane of everyone in the area. I know SP, FS, etc. all have incredibly difficult times making radio contact. There is just no signal in those valleys because of the height of the mountains. And that is really no secret, its basic wave propagation. Bill
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Since: Nov 08
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rozShoem wrote: Hint, hint:
Possibly the interviews should NOT have been limited to only the registered sex offenders living in the area. What do you think, Bill? I know you're using very good judgment in your comments (science based, fact based), but like me lean toward the possibility she met with foul play. I didn't think that any of the people interviewed, SBD, CW, or the married couple, I didn't think any of them were sex offenders? So it seems they did interview others than sex offenders. I actually lean nowhere. It is odd there is no activity on her cards, etc. That means to me that she either changed her name and is living somewhere else or she is totally off the grid paying for everything with cash, etc. or she is dead. If she is dead than she either ran off into the woods and died there or possibly ran from the car and died hours, days later. The phone call, which I would discount, except people that knew her best insist that it is her happened many hours later. So here we are, with lots of contradictory evidence. What I am sure of is that she lied to get away at least for a while to cover her tracks so no one would know what she was doing. It could also be interpreted as giving her a tremendous head start. I am also certain that she crashed the car and she ran from the car. To the end purpose I don't know. Bill
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rozShoem
Gouverneur, NY
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Observer - Troy Michigan wrote: Thank you. I happened upon this forum by accident and was taken aback by some things I read about a POI. For the sake of some people I love, I am glad to know there is not a POI. Troy, Don't wrap your security blanket too tightly. Not just yet. Just because a POI has not been identified, does not mean the scoundrel is not out there laughing his butt off because he was never interviewed (has not been identified). His laughter is only surpassed by the confidence he is gaining with each abduction, each kill. It will be interesting to see at what NUMBER (of disappearances and discoveries of remains/dead bodies) this perpetrator finally becomes a POI. Sometimes, like with everything else, it becomes a matter of numbers,unfortunately, no matter how many arrows might point to a certain individual. This is at times the case, especially if the man or woman is not on the sexual offenders'list.
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rozShoem
Gouverneur, NY
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WTH-the-original wrote: <quoted text>
Many good questions. I don't know if he was interviewed. I'll point out that there is only one road in that area that directly goes anywhere and if I remember correctly he lived nearby. And these may be all questions that may have been asked and answered, I don't know.
As far as him not responding to dispatch, you really need to know the area. Radio reception is the bane of everyone in the area. I know SP, FS, etc. all have incredibly difficult times making radio contact. There is just no signal in those valleys because of the height of the mountains. And that is really no secret, its basic wave propagation.
Bill Bill, For a lot of reason, it would have been helpful to determine from which direction both the Haverhill officer and the ST arrived at the scene of the accident (Maura's). It is known the officer arrived at 7:46 p.m......but it is not known what time the ST arrived on the scene. This information, including the direction from which both individuals had come, would be important to identifying timeframes. The distance from the accident scene to the Saturn is also important information. Did nearby residents see the ST at the accident scene? Some reports indicate the Saturn was removed from the scene at approximately 8 p.m..... so it appears from the time the Saturn left the highway to the time it was hauled off to a local garage involved approximately one hour. By interviewing EVERYONE who was at the accident scene it would be possible to establish events, etc. that occurred within that one-hour timeframe. Even the driver of the truck who hauled the Saturn to the local garage.....he should have been interviewed to establish at what time he had arrived at the accident scene. Information provided by everyone at the scene could have been compared....to establish even more accuracy as to who was at the accident scene and at what time. Then there is all of the confusion around the car that had slid off the highway that evening in a different location prior to Maura's accident. Was it ever confirmed that Maura was not involved in this previous incident? My understanding is that this car was leaving the scene just as the officer arrived (was this the same Haverhill officer who responded to site where Saturn was located?). Establishing times of these incidents, who was there and who was not would seem important.
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rozShoem
Gouverneur, NY
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Bill, By the distance from the accident scene to the Saturn I need to clarify. I'm asking about the distance from where any signs, car tracks in snow (sliding) began...to where car ended up off the highway. I've read the road was snow-covered. Also, about how far was the Saturn from the intersection where the dog lost scent? Was that intersection visible from any houses in that area? Thanks.
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Since: Nov 08
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rozShoem wrote: <quoted text>
Bill,
For a lot of reason, it would have been helpful to determine from which direction both the Haverhill officer and the ST arrived at the scene of the accident (Maura's). It is known the officer arrived at 7:46 p.m......but it is not known what time the ST arrived on the scene. This information, including the direction from which both individuals had come, would be important to identifying timeframes. The distance from the accident scene to the Saturn is also important information. Did nearby residents see the ST at the accident scene? Some reports indicate the Saturn was removed from the scene at approximately 8 p.m..... so it appears from the time the Saturn left the highway to the time it was hauled off to a local garage involved approximately one hour. By interviewing EVERYONE who was at the accident scene it would be possible to establish events, etc. that occurred within that one-hour timeframe. Even the driver of the truck who hauled the Saturn to the local garage.....he should have been interviewed to establish at what time he had arrived at the accident scene. Information provided by everyone at the scene could have been compared....to establish even more accuracy as to who was at the accident scene and at what time. Then there is all of the confusion around the car that had slid off the highway that evening in a different location prior to Maura's accident. Was it ever confirmed that Maura was not involved in this previous incident? My understanding is that this car was leaving the scene just as the officer arrived (was this the same Haverhill officer who responded to site where Saturn was located?). Establishing times of these incidents, who was there and who was not would seem important. Again some of these are legitimate questions. You are going by what you think you know and much of this is third and fourth hand information. You make assumptions based upon what you think you know. What you know is very likely much, much less than the investigators know. This is why I don't stray into fantasy land. There is no reported information on some of this. I refuse to speculate when I don't know the answer to certain issues because then speculation eventually turns to fact. Bill
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Since: Nov 08
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rozShoem wrote: Bill,
By the distance from the accident scene to the Saturn I need to clarify. I'm asking about the distance from where any signs, car tracks in snow (sliding) began...to where car ended up off the highway. I've read the road was snow-covered. Also, about how far was the Saturn from the intersection where the dog lost scent? Was that intersection visible from any houses in that area?
Thanks. Look at the police report. In that report he clearly made a diagram showing the initial slide into the trees and reflection out of the the trees with the car place very near. The road was not snow covered from what we have been told and the police report listed it as dry (check the report to make sure I remember this correctly) but of course there was snow on the sides of the road. There may have been light frost on the road but that also appears to be in dispute. The scent was reported to be lost near or in front of SBDs house which is very close to the intersection of Bradley Hill Rd. That area is open enough that there could have been (I believe) five houses that might have sight if they were looking. Something that hasn't been talked about much is that the scent trail followed by the dog(s) is not necessarily the path that Maura took. I can elaborate if you want but everyone seems to assume that was the path Maura took, that isn't necessarily true. Having been tracked by dogs and watching their behavior tracking me I know this to be fact. Bill
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Looking4AMoose
Woonsocket, RI
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rozShoem wrote: <quoted text>
Based on dog handler, scent was lost down the highway at intersection. So a reasonable possibility is that a vehicle stopped there.....Maura felt safe and got in with this person. Okay, Bill. Let's as you say, "take this piece by piece."
-Maura rejected assistance from SBD.
-Maura did NOT knock on doors of any houses in area to seek help
-Based on theory she got into someone's car at that intersection,
where dog lost scent, she must have had REASON to trust the
driver of this car
Now...let's consider who most people SHOULD have reason to trust....
ANY ideas? Maybe a friend in a red pick up truck with Mass. plates that she planned to meet?
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linda
Saint Paul, MN
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Wasn't there a red pickup truck parked down some road that night? I have to wonder too Looking4aMoose, if Maura was meeting up with, or avoiding the person driving it. I mean what are the chances RO would notice a red truck slowing down as thought to see if it were someone they "knew"?, and a RED truck parked closer to where "Maura" would be discovered missing? RO saw the red truck, then police going past the store and in the direction of the accident site. When RO walked home, The ST drove along her street. He said "oh, it's you". Could this imply he had been down by the weathered barn, then doubled back to the area where that truck had been seen. Maybe he thought they seemed to be lingering in the normal course of his duties that night? Isn't the area of the Swiftwater store, a different jurisdiction? Maybe not. But still, he went down her street maybe because of the elderly lady who needed an ambulance, and at the same time to look for the "girl". Maybe the one who had left in a private vehicle....who knows about that part. But trucks were pulled over that night. Shack stated that ST went to the call where the troubled teenager was climbing poles or something. This is an investigation and if ST plays any part in the events of that night, it seems fair that we don't get that info. CS doesn't say much either, mostly quotes like 'stuffing rags into tailpipes is a Ma thing. For the record, CS played the biggest role and yet he does not say what took place when SBD and himself went looking around for some 15 minutes, for "Maura". The other police give us the info second hand, officially, like spokesman do. Maybe that's as it should be. they asked if she had shown up at the Cottage Hospital. That's interesting in
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linda
Saint Paul, MN
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That's interesting in.....in itself.
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Shack
Groton, MA
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Linda ..tiny corrections...RO encountered SP JM on
her way TO the store...not FROM.
And RO's street was/is a street OFF of 112. It is Bunxxx Road. The same street as the ambulance call regarding "elderly" call.
From memory (don't trust it) it was kin of RO....
BEFORE the runaway lad from the private school.
If I read your post wrong...ignore the above. ;-/
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Since: Nov 08
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linda wrote: For the record, CS played the biggest role and yet he does not say what took place when SBD and himself went looking around for some 15 minutes, for "Maura". Just checking but you think that if CS or SBD found Maura when they were searching they just forgot to tell everyone? Bill
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linda
Saint Paul, MN
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WTH-the-original wrote: <quoted text>
Just checking but you think that if CS or SBD found Maura when they were searching they just forgot to tell everyone?
Bill Heck no. My writing was due to all the talk about the ST not making any statements to the father/general public. Seems fair to me that these things cannot be discussed. Scarinza, Williams, and so on do the talking. I'm certain CS and SBD did not find Maura that night. But if they would have, it wouldn't be going on like this I'm sure. Maybe not even if she wanted to disappear and had every right to cut the ties with family as to her whereabouts, etc. Because whatever she did wrong would be public record just the same as anyone else who crashes into property, leaves her car sitting, maybe drinking and driving. Someone would have found that in the paper or something. So and so damages property, charged with DUI, whatever. Thank you for asking me though.
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linda
Saint Paul, MN
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Judged:
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Shack wrote: Linda ..tiny corrections...RO encountered SP JM on
her way TO the store...not FROM.
And RO's street was/is a street OFF of 112. It is Bunxxx Road. The same street as the ambulance call regarding "elderly" call.
From memory (don't trust it) it was kin of RO....
BEFORE the runaway lad from the private school.
If I read your post wrong...ignore the above. ;-/ Hi Shack. It's past bedtime for me, this was all I could find on RO at the moment. I did copy/paste what RO had to say about that night about 2 months ago, on Topix. I'm pretty sure she was walking home. In the meantime, here's what EWB said: Peri, I am going on memory here but I specifically recall RO stating that an elderly relative of hers frequently called 911 (Bunga Road 911 call) and it sounded as though the relative might possibly have been in the latter stages of dimentia. I also believe RO was walking home from the Stage Stop when Monoghan pulled up to her and said, "Oh, it's you". As I am sure most are aware, Monoghan was the Trooper who told RO her daughter was in a fatal accident.
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rozShoem
Gouverneur, NY
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WTH-the-original wrote: <quoted text>
You almost got it right. Unfortunately, your thinking takes a wicked right hand turn into "fantasy" land where you say "she must have had a reason to trust..."
Nothing could be further from the truth. Once she knew the cops were coming and she decided to run, she could have gotten into anyone's car that came by. She did the basic math. One road in, one road out and that road is 25 miles in length, its cold and dark. She likely thought, I need a ride. That person was Maura's target of opportunity.
Bill Bill, Not "fantasy" land. I base my conclusion on the "fact" that Maura had not accepted help from SBD. I'd read that someone close to SBD had said if you did not know him (SBD), his appearance could be quite intimidating....and of course Maura did not knock on the doors of nearby houses (at least according to reports). This makes sense as she could not see who was inside of the houses. People have been known to enter the door to an even worse situation than their current dilemma). However, Maura may have got into a vehicle at that intersection where the dog lost scent....(there were no signs of a struggle in the snow, etc)....no one heard any screams, etc). She simply quietly vanished into thin air or a vehicle. The "vehicle" idea seems a better option than "thin air." So why then, after rejecting help from all other sources, would she feel safe and be trusting enough of the driver of the vehicle that had stopped at that intersection? One thing remains certain. No signs, indication of a struggle....and please do not tell me that this guy might have forced her into his vehicle at gun point. This guy's presentation causes a person to let down his/her guard in terms of cautiousness, in terms of safety.
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“"Dancing with wolves"”
Since: Oct 10
Location hidden
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rozShoem Farmersville Station, NY Reply » |Report Abuse |Judge it! |#72 Dec 22, 2010 Judged: Okay. Depressive state? Strained relationship? Why would anyone wait 25 years to react? Really! All of these disappearances, missing people, homicides, suspected homicides and suspicious deaths... What on earth is going on? People are coming from miles around to disappear and/or die in Grafton County? What is the magnetic attraction of this place? Maybe it's time to cease analyzing lives of the missing and/or the murdered and redirect the focus on the psychopathic anomaly who evidentally continues to freely roam the highways of VT, NH and ME at all hours of the day and night. Hey Roz you may want to ask Christopher what the magnetic attraction of this area is as his friend posted on his thread that Christopher is alive, looking well and should be home today. Funny that you only post the negative things about the Grafton County area but when something good happens you fail to say a word. Again your accusations and theories of what happened were proven wrong. I find this to be wonderful news because if Chris has shown up after almost nine months then that gives hope Maura and others missing could also be alive and well.
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Ricardo
Sacramento, CA
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rozShoem wrote: <quoted text>
Bill,
Not "fantasy" land. Belcome to Bontasea Oylan. What is your Bontasea?
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Since: Nov 08
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rozShoem wrote: <quoted text>
Bill,
Not "fantasy" land. I base my conclusion on the "fact" that Maura had not accepted help from SBD. I'd read that someone close to SBD had said if you did not know him (SBD), his appearance could be quite intimidating....and of course Maura did not knock on the doors of nearby houses (at least according to reports). This makes sense as she could not see who was inside of the houses. People have been known to enter the door to an even worse situation than their current dilemma). However, Maura may have got into a vehicle at that intersection where the dog lost scent....(there were no signs of a struggle in the snow, etc)....no one heard any screams, etc). She simply quietly vanished into thin air or a vehicle. The "vehicle" idea seems a better option than "thin air." So why then, after rejecting help from all other sources, would she feel safe and be trusting enough of the driver of the vehicle that had stopped at that intersection? One thing remains certain. No signs, indication of a struggle....and please do not tell me that this guy might have forced her into his vehicle at gun point. This guy's presentation causes a person to let down his/her guard in terms of cautiousness, in terms of safety. First, let me say that it was SBD who said that he could understand Maura not wanting to catch a ride with him as his appearance might intimidate her. Second, you seem to want to disregard that she wants to escape the area. She doesn't go to homes because that isn't far enough. Her goal, her only goal is escape. She would have gotten into ANYONES's vehicle who didn't physically spit venom at her. And no, I have never thought that she was kidnapped from that area. And again, as a last thought, where the dogs lost her scent may have nothing to do with where the car that picked her up, actually was located. Bill
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Euroobserver
Sweden
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Since Maura most likely had been drinking alcohol on her way from Amherst MA, up north, she was quite clearly unwilling to await the likely arrival of LE at her car on Rte 112 near the Weathered Barn curve.
Apparently, she asked Mr Atwood - the school bus driver - not to call police and told him that she already had called AAA,despite - from what I´ve read - very bad to non-existent cellphone coverage in the area in question.
She also did not knock on the door of any of the houses nearby.
The impression is - IMHO - that Maura wished to get away from her car as soon as possible, in order not to have to face the arrival of the police.
Is it therefore likely that she willingly would have entered a LE vehicle at this point, as hinted at as a possibility in some posts here?
Most probably not, considering the circumstances.
Would she have been willing to take the chance of getting a ride from a passer-by in, perhaps, a red pick-up truck?
Quite possibly yes.
Having for a long time been hoping against all reason that Maura might be alive and well and living a new life with a new identity, I now very much fear that something terrible most likely happened to her when she quite possibly entered an unknown vehicle on Rte 112.
It´s now been seven long years, after all.
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rozShoem
Gouverneur, NY
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Wowzer the real one wrote: rozShoem
Farmersville Station, NY
Reply »
|Report Abuse
|Judge it!
|#72
Dec 22, 2010 Judged:
Okay. Depressive state? Strained relationship? Why would anyone wait 25 years to react? Really! All of these disappearances, missing people, homicides, suspected homicides and suspicious deaths... What on earth is going on? People are coming from miles around to disappear and/or die in Grafton County? What is the magnetic attraction of this place? Maybe it's time to cease analyzing lives of the missing and/or the murdered and redirect the focus on the psychopathic anomaly who evidentally continues to freely roam the highways of VT, NH and ME at all hours of the day and night.
Hey Roz you may want to ask Christopher what the magnetic attraction of this area is as his friend posted on his thread that Christopher is alive, looking well and should be home today.
Funny that you only post the negative things about the Grafton County area but when something good happens you fail to say a word. Again your accusations and theories of what happened were proven wrong.
I find this to be wonderful news because if Chris has shown up after almost nine months then that gives hope Maura and others missing could also be alive and well. Hi, The "key" word you use is "if." Accusations? Theories, ideas...but not accusations. True....I'm not a proponent of theory that often prevails....that these missing people are victims of suicide or are hiding out somewhere. A few of them may be.....but many of them are not. You say, "If Chris has shown up..." Let's wait and see if this is fact, fiction or fantasy.
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