Maura Murray

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Orko Kringer wrote:

Back to the rag in the tailpipe:
I guess with the recent death of the MTV "Buckwild" star due to carbon monoxide poisoning from his truck's tailpipe being clogged up with mud (him and two friends were out mudding and they got stuck), that it proves that you don't need a tube feeding into your car to result in death.
Back to Maura.
Was the rag stuffed into the taipipe, a quick attempt at taking her own life that night (as the lead investigator in maura murray's disappearance has suggested), before she gave up and just fled the scene?

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whiston wrote:

Hi all,Rick Graves found vodka bottle on lime kiln road I am gessing a bar code tells a lot. Sgt.Smith went to lime kiln road to look for the person from the Beckett school.the person that was in the report by Sgt.Smith after the stop on petticoat lane lived or lives on limekiln road. take care philip

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WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Before this takes on a life of its own, some corrections.
The tailpipe was not clogged. Based upon the description, the mechanism for these deaths was likely this. The vehicle was stuck, buried in mud making a seal partially around the bottom of the cab of the vehicle. Carbon monoxide built up under the cab and with no where else to go was forced into the cab killing the people inside.
And notice, that the vehicle didn't stall even while the muffler was resting under the mud. Again, it is very difficult if not impossible to stall a modern high compression engine by trying to block the exhaust.
Bill

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Orko Kringer wrote:

Back to the rag in the tailpipe:
I guess with the recent death of the MTV "Buckwild" star due to carbon monoxide poisoning from his truck's tailpipe being clogged up with mud (him and two friends were out mudding and they got stuck), that it proves that you don't need a tube feeding into your car to result in death.
Back to Maura.
Was the rag stuffed into the taipipe, a quick attempt at taking her own life that night (as the lead investigator in maura murray's disappearance has suggested), before she gave up and just fled the scene?

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WTH-the-original wrote:

<quoted text>
Before this takes on a life of its own, some corrections.
The tailpipe was not clogged. Based upon the description, the mechanism for these deaths was likely this. The vehicle was stuck, buried in mud making a seal partially around the bottom of the cab of the vehicle. Carbon monoxide built up under the cab and with no where else to go was forced into the cab killing the people inside.
And notice, that the vehicle didn't stall even while the muffler was resting under the mud. Again, it is very difficult if not impossible to stall a modern high compression engine by trying to block the exhaust.
Bill

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Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
just think about thus a moment...you can OD to commit suicide with OTC meds, prescibed meds and illegal drugs.
you can veer off the road/highway at the posted limit, or in excess of it, hit a guardrail and roll, a tree, or a telephone poll...and die.
you don't need to rig up a Kevirkian in a public place by stuffing a "rag", however lightly or firmly, up a tailpipe.
pardon me if i laugh and/or eyeroll at such a preposterous idea.

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Orko Kringer wrote:

<quoted text>
Not sure what point you are trying to prove. DO you think Maura was raped? Why wasn't it reported?
Two completely different sources place the get together at Kennedy unless I am misinterpretating something from the true crime book article which says maura left the party and went upstairs to her room.
Is that some big scandal that the get together was at kennedy or a nearby dorm and how does that change anything citigirl?
regardless of which dorm the party was at It doesn't make maura's decision and more brighter to leave a party in the middle of the night and get out on the road.

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Orko Kringer wrote:

<quoted text>
Eyeroll till your hearts content.
I guess you are eye-rolling at what had been the lead investigator into maura's disapperaance the now retired Lt. Scarinza. He's the one that suggested the rag in the tailpipe may have been a suicide attempt.
Your scenarios make no sense, considering maura had just wrecked and was probably feeling quite depressed, scared and vulnerable while she sit in the dark in the middle of nowhere with a smashed car and no plan whatsoever (unless you think the wreck was staged).
Thought (in the moment) may have been to take her life with whatever resources were available.

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Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
he also suggested she may have accepted a ride. he says he doesn't know what happened.
he's in good company.
"depressed, scared and vulnerable". well, you don't allow for the probable plan she likely had in place when she set out to leave UMASS. perhaps her plan was well considered....until....she drank? before she drove? while she was driving? or as a passenger?
who was she running from?
who was she running to?
who might have accompanied her or followed her?
lots of questions. zero answers.
"depressed, scared and vulnerable".
i thought she was intelligent / capable / high functioning / trained (at some level) in survival / an experienced outdoors young woman
who is/was Maura Murray?
what matters most is the meltdown, multi car crashes in as many days, the packed dorm room, the "death in the family" lie, and pending issues with law enforcement.
isolating the issue to the place where the Saturn landed is short-sighted, imo.
the "rag" is unexplained. and perhaps the least of it.

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citigirl wrote:

<quoted text>My point is small party verses a room stuffed with people. It can only be one or the other. I never used the word scandel. Just trying to keep the facts straight.

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Orko Kringer wrote:

<quoted text>
So ..........
The million dollar question to you then is, if you know for certain that maura's dorm get-together wasn't at her dorm but in a different dorm, then why don't you state which dorm it was held in.
There is no good reason on earth why --- nine years later ---- stating which dorm a get-together took place in would be some big piece of evidence that might hinder a missing person's investigation if it didn't involve a rape or a scandal.
And if we can't get past what dorm a party took place in nine years ago, then there is no hope for ever solving maura's disappearance.

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Orko Kringer wrote:

<quoted text>
Not to be argumenative (and maybe I am mis-reading here)
But this is from police accounts
"Shain's uncle and a male friend also died while inside Shain's 1984 Bronco, which had stalled out in mud while the crew went off-roading over the weekend. The truck's exhaust pipe had apparently been submerged in mud, causing the gas to leak back into the car."
Other news accounts have stated the tailpipe was clogged up with mud.

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Orko Kringer wrote:

<quoted text>
His (Lt. Scarinza) exact quote was "Why in the hell else would you stick a rag in a tailpipe" in answering if its not a suicide attempt.
So yes, I understand he doesn't no for sure what the rag means, but it's pretty clear (I think at least) where he leans toward for what the rag meant by his reply.
Regardless, I agree with you 100 percent that the events prior to the wreck hold the keys to this mystery.
I am in the suicide theory camp (have been there for a long time, following the evidence) and I still don't believe maura's second wreck was planned or that she initially set out to take her life at the scene of the car wreck. But the car wreck definitely was a game/plan changer for her IMO.
And who knows what final decision she came up with on the fly that night. But it didn't involve taking with her (clothes and valuables) but it did involve taking (at least) a bottle of alcohol.

Snowy wrote:

<quoted text>
well, Orko, the longer i think about it, the more confusing it becomes. lots of moving parts, and nothing fits together. too many missing pieces.
certain people very close to Maura must have a more accurate "profile" of the real Maura....and, still, may not know some aspect of her private life, her relationships, and her activities.
could Billy, her sisters, brothers and father not have known about some important dynamic or feature of her life that caused her to leave UMASS that day?
which of them, or none of them, knows something? or nothing?
which friend holds the key to some piece of information that could unlock the mystery of her disappearance?
and if someone close to her knows, how could they, in good conscience, keep such information from authorities? who could live with themselves under those circumstances?
it's so hard to believe she was the target of a crime of opportunity, mostly because the circumstances of her leaving were out of character, and probably motivated by some event / trigger that happened at UMASS.
suicide seems quite possible, given the stresses in her life, but a depressed and desperate young woman wouldn't need to travel to her "beloved" white mountains to achieve that end. now i'm curious to enough to look into the stats about suicide in that age group, by gender, method, and location. hmmmm.

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citigirl wrote:

Orko " His (Lt. Scarinza) exact quote was "Why in the hell else would you stick a rag in a tailpipe" in answering if its not a suicide attempt" Did you talk to Scarinza or did you read this somewhere? If you read it could you please give me the link. Thank you.

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Snowy wrote:

google is my friend. not a scholarly article, but some basic stats on suicide. Maura doesn't fall into the demographic, but she could be an outlier.
http://www.afsp.org/understanding-suicide/fac...